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Chrishayden "Cyniquian" Level Poster Username: Chrishayden
Post Number: 661 Registered: 03-2004
Rating: N/A Votes: 0 (Vote!) | Posted on Friday, September 24, 2004 - 12:30 pm: |
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This discussion came up in another discussion group. It will drive Abm, who is obsessed with the crotches of comic book characters, crazy, but that's a price AALBC has to pay. So much discussion has taken place over the use of "nigger" in Huckleberry Finn that another possible issue has gone overlooked. Were Huck and Jim lovers? We all know now that Samuel Langhorne Clemens/aka Mark Twain was not the folksy, avuncular warmhearted backwoods storyteller we have been sold. He was a sarcastic man, probably an atheist, who loathed society for its hypocrisies and fakeries. Was he putting one over on his Victorian audience with Huckleberry Finn? Was the relationship betwen Huck and Jim a romantic one? |
Cynique "Cyniquian" Level Poster Username: Cynique
Post Number: 1397 Registered: 01-2004
Rating: N/A Votes: 0 (Vote!) | Posted on Friday, September 24, 2004 - 02:48 pm: |
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I don't know about Jim and Huck, Chris, but from the way you described the real Mark Twain, I think I'm in love. Along these lines, I was watching a cable documentary a while back on how during the 50s and 60s the gay community of Hollywood directors would inject subtle little inside jokes into films about relationships between leading men, one case in point being the interaction between Laurence Olivier and a male co-star in the epic movie Spartacus. But - what do I know? It took me a while to figure out that the Beatles hit song "Lucy in the Sky with Diamonds" referred to LSD. I did, however, realize that "Mary Jane" was a nickname for marijuana |
Abm "Cyniquian" Level Poster Username: Abm
Post Number: 1365 Registered: 04-2004
Rating: N/A Votes: 0 (Vote!) | Posted on Friday, September 24, 2004 - 02:55 pm: |
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Cynique, You’ve gottah know it would be Chris (of all of us) who would try to ‘out’ Huck Finn and Jim. |
Chrishayden "Cyniquian" Level Poster Username: Chrishayden
Post Number: 662 Registered: 03-2004
Rating: N/A Votes: 0 (Vote!) | Posted on Friday, September 24, 2004 - 04:44 pm: |
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I mentioned this theory over at the Afrofuturism site and they told me this is an old theory, first surfacing more than 50 years ago in an essay called "Come Back to the Raft Ag'in, Huck Honey!" by Leslie Fiedler and carried on again in "Innocent Homosexuality: The Fiedler Thesis in Retrospect" by Christopher Looby and again by Robyn Wiegman in "Fiedler and Sons". Hmmm |
Steve_s Newbie Poster Username: Steve_s
Post Number: 10 Registered: 04-2004
Rating: Votes: 1 (Vote!) | Posted on Wednesday, September 29, 2004 - 10:36 pm: |
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"Do you still believe that st-st-stuff about Huck Finn?" asked Ernest Hemingway upon meeting Leslie Fiedler in 1960. He was referring to the critic's notorious 1948 essay in the Partisan Review, "Come back to the raft ag'in, Huck Honey!," in which Fiedler had described Mark Twain's Huck and Jim as enjoying an idyllic homoerotic interracial bond, an "immaculate male love" celebrated as well in Moby-Dick and in The Last of the Mohicans. In the essay, Fiedler describes Hemingway as an "improbable" recent instance of this American tradition that can imagine "an ennobling or redemptive love only between males in flight from women and civilization." In their meeting, both men carefully avoided lingering on this delicate subject. Over the decades, the article became the most influential single essay ever written about American literature. It served as the basis of Fiedler's masterpiece Love and Death in the American Novel (1960), usually regarded, along with the book that influenced it, D.H. Lawrence's Studies in Classic American Literature, as one of the few indispensable works in the field.
But Fiedler's ideas resonated far beyond the academy to echo throughout American culture. His influence is palpable in Ken Kesey's One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest (1962), with its redemptive comradeship between red man and white, revealing a self-conscious primitivism Fiedler would later call the "Higher Masculine Sentimentality." Indeed, Fiedler helped in another, smaller way to make the novel possible: He urged a national fellowship committee he sat on to make an award to Kesey, enabling him to enter Stanford's creative-writing program, where the book was born. This past January, just before his death at the age of eighty-five, the New York Times reported Fiedler's surprised delight upon finding himself mentioned on The Sopranos. In the show, Columbia undergraduate Meadow Soprano tells her mother she has been reading Leslie Fiedler for a paper about homoeroticism in Billy Budd. "Who is she?" asks Carmela Soprano.
Gender confusion aside, Mrs. Soprano's question has often been answered with phrases like "enfant terrible" and "bad boy"; indeed, the first phrase is the title of a chapter in Mark Royden Winchell's informative recent biography of Fiedler. Pugnacious, if sweet tempered, a self-described troublemaker, Fiedler made Melville's "No! in thunder" his motto and the title of his second book. But the rude-boy public image is only part of the story. His reputation rests on his incisive critiques of literary and political innocence and immaturity. -- Innocents at Home: Ross Posnock on the Legacy of Leslie Fiedler Chris, When I read Huckleberry Finn earlier this year I tried to keep Fieldler's idea in mind, but the following paragraph, in which Jim and Huck spend time together on the island if I remember correctly, is about the only situation which seems to apply. Obviously Jim is an adult and Huck is a kid, so, depending on what your definition of naked is, it's a little weird for a kid to be hanging out with a naked adult.
Soon as it was night out we shoved; when we got her out to about the middle we let her alone, and let her float wherever the current wanted her to; then we lit the pipes, and dangled our legs in the water, and talked about all kinds of things -- we was always naked, day and night, whenever the mosquitoes would let us -- the new clothes Buck's folks made for me was too good to be comfortable, and besides I didn't go much on clothes, nohow. -- The Adventures of Huckleberry Finn, Chapter XIX Ralph Ellison didn't agree with Fiedler's thesis about homoeroticism in The Adventures of Huckleberry Finn, but, judging from what he says about Fiedler in the essay Change the Joke and Slip the Yoke, it sounds like he generally appreciated Fiedler's willingness to analyze depictions of race in literature from a psychological or psychosexual perspective. I think that's because he thought that way himself.
The [Ralph Ellison essay] "Black Mask of Humanity" reversed the Du Boisian notion of a veil separating blacks from whites and malforming the blacks. Instead, Ellison shifted the gaze toward black strength and essential humanity. He also examined white sickness, chiefly in the form of a psychological repression that cemented onto the image of the Negro taboo desires and fears. -- Ralph Ellison: Emergence of Genius, Lawrence Jackson I think the last part about "taboo desires and fears" is important and may even be related to what Fiedler describes as the homoeroticism between interracial characters in 19th century American fiction. You can see it in Moby-Dick where Ishmael and Queequeg sleep together in the same bed, Queequeg with his arm around Ishmael. We know that black stereotypes have historically been highly sexualized (I cringe whenever I read Disgrace by J.M. Coetzee or even the rape scene in Drop City by T.C. Boyle), and so what Fiedler may have been picking up on was the reverse of that: the authors' attempts to use intimacy with white buddies to "vouch" for black and Polynesian characters like Jim and Queequeg to white readers. The Fortress of Solitude by Jonathan Lethem is a 2003 novel which may actually make Fiedler's point better than Huckleberry Finn or Moby Dick (except that it's not as essential a book). I see it as basically a modern remake of Huckleberry Finn in which the "territory" has moved to the outer boroughs of Manhattan. The plot concerns a Jewish boy who integrates an all-black public school in Brooklyn. His name is Dylan, his black friend in named Mingus, and the Tom Sawyer surrogate is named Arthur Lomb. Dylan and Mingus have a sexual relationship (or else they're miscegenating musical forms). Ellison's said that 19th century authors like Twain and Melville peeled back the minstrel mask "and it is from behind this stereotype mask that we see Jim's dignity and complexity emerge." (Ellison) Another example would be The Man in My Basement by Walter Mosley, in which the white man, Anniston Bennett, tells Charles Blakey about the cook in Moby-Dick. He doesn't mention that the cook is black. The chapter is called "Stubbs' Supper" and the cook is a stereotypical minstrel figure, but his mesage about redemption is an important one (to Mosley, for one).
Ultimately, Fiedler might be best understood as Melvillean if we mean that he contains both the thunderous No of Ahab and the ludic Yes of Ishmael infused with the spirit of "godly gamesomeness." "I condemn and affirm, say no and say yes," declares Ralph Ellison's narrator at the majestic end of Invisible Man (1952). This canonical postwar double voice signals a deliberate gesture of kinship with Fiedler. While looking for work in New York, the novel's bumpkin protagonist meets Mr. Emerson, a young white homosexual who attempts to befriend him. To put the recently arrived Southerner at ease, Mr. Emerson says of his racially mixed social set, "With us it's still Jim and Huck Finn," and describes himself as "one of the unspeakables . . . I'm Huckleberry, you see . . ." The baffled narrator wonders to himself: "Huckleberry? Why did he keep talking about that kid's story?" All invisible man wants is a job, but young Emerson pointedly asks, "Aren't you curious about what lies behind the face of things?" Not only does Ellison have fun here with his naive narrator, he also allusively enlists Fiedler's thesis to serve as a metaphor for the debunking of American innocence, a skepticism about the mere "face of things" that invisible man will eventually achieve. In effect, Ellison makes Fiedler an ally in achieving a flexibly self-aware adulthood. -- Posnock, ibid. Emerson invites the Invisible Man to the Club Calamus, which is a reference to the Calamus chapter in Leaves of Grass in which Walt Whitman discusses his homosexuality. I ain't the man in the basement, S |
Thumper "Cyniquian" Level Poster Username: Thumper
Post Number: 279 Registered: 01-2004
Rating: N/A Votes: 0 (Vote!) | Posted on Sunday, October 10, 2004 - 09:31 am: |
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Hello All, Steve S: How are you doing, man? Here you done dropped by and I missed you. *smile* I will admit that I did not catch the full meaning of the homosexual hints that Ellison was dropping in portions of Invisible Man. I do find it interesting though. I'm going to have to re read it and see if I agree with your assessment. As far as Jim and Huckleberry, I have to disagree. In my opinion, Jim saw Huck as a child, even though (if my memory is serving me correctly Huch was around 13 or 14 years old at the time of the book. The passage that was used in the post of Jim and Huck being naked most of the day doesn't say or hint homosexual to me. Considering the time that the book was written it was nothing for men or boys to go swimming in the nude. It was done all the time with no sexual contations attached to it. I'm not sure of the date that swim wear was invented, but soemthing tells me that even if swim wear was created in the 1800's, Huck or Jim couldn't afford to buy themselves a suit. Now, I will admit that Jim called Huck "honey" an awfully lot, but that again was because he saw Huck as a child. Grown folks often use these terms of endearment when talking to children, "baby", "sweetheart", "darling", etc. If anything, we, members of the current society is guilty of is constantly reinventing the wheel. By that I mean, when I was growing up, it was not unusual for black men to call the other "baby", "boyfriend" (I was taught to say "friend boy"). Somewhere along in the 70s, these terms came to imply homosexuality, even where it did not exist. |
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