| Author |
Message |
    
Zane
First Time Poster
Username: Zane
Post Number: 1
Registered: 11-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, March 16, 2005 - 07:55 am: | 
|
It has been a while since I posted on the board but I do read it. I have a question I want to pose to everyone. Do you feel it is okay for black bookstore owners or bookstore owners period, for that matter, to talk trash about an author's writing style or skills and then sell their books anyway to make a dollar? After all, if they are so much against an author, are they not hypocrites by peddling the same books they so avidly denounce?
Peace, Zane |
Jmho
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Jmho
Post Number: 117
Registered: 03-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, March 16, 2005 - 09:08 am: |
|
Should a business owner have to personally like each and every product (or service) that he or she sells? If so, then many business owners will have a very limited inventory. Just as many customers ask owners or the sales personnel for recommendations -- but they don't have to take them.
Some business owners know they are selling good *and* bad or inferior products, but if their customers like the inferior products, then why shouldn't meet the demand of those particular customers?
Just as a writer might write things in a book they he or she will never do, should they not write about it to make a dollar, as to not be considered a hypocrite? |
Yvettep
Veteran Poster
Username: Yvettep
Post Number: 57
Registered: 01-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, March 16, 2005 - 11:50 am: |
|
I think part of the issue is that generally Black bookstore owners--and, perhaps, most independent bookstore owners of whatever background--have served a dual role: that of a business owner (e.g., "selling products") and a community leader who helps advocate for and promote literacy.
I have only personally known one African American bookstore owner, and I know that for her it was a struggle to "make a dollar"; She seemed to be doing what she did largely because she loved books and because she embraced that latter role.
However having said that, I do think that especially for African American bookstore owners, there is probably a way to fulfill both roles without "trashing" anyone's writing. The relationship between a good bookseller and a loyal customer can be a very inimate one. Over time, it is probably possible for that bookseller to guide that person to works the bookseller is more keen on, in light of full knowledge of what the customer has liked in the past.
I think it is foolish for any bookstore owner to publically denounce anyone who provides her/him with inventory. And afterall, today's unpolished author just may be tomorrow's award winner... |
Zane
Newbie Poster
Username: Zane
Post Number: 5
Registered: 11-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, March 16, 2005 - 04:44 pm: |
|
Thanks for the opinions. I brought this up because two bookstore owners have publicly denounced me over and over and then expect me to autograph books for their stores or do signings. As an up-and-coming bookstore owner, no, I will not personally like all the books in my store. However, I will not be talking trash about authors and then smile in their faces or expect things from them under the pretense that they need to "support black bookstores." It is a two-way street. It amazes me, in general, how much time people spend downing authors in articles and over the Internet when they could spend that same time and energy uplifting authors they do appreciate. It tickles me when people say negative things about me. I never expected everyone to like my writing. Any author who does is crazy. However, the fact that someone would blame me or other authors for the lack of success of others is asinine. As I move forward to doing films, the last thing I am worried about is what other films are coming out and how much money they make compared to what I make. I would not even speak on this except I am sick of two-faced people who have selective memory about what they said about me when they want me to come and help them pay some bills. Unless things are spoken out loud, people will ignore it. Bottom line, as far as I am concerned, there is no such thing as negative publicity. For every single negative thing posted about me, article or opinion, someone reads it and heads to a bookstore to purchase my books to see what kind of writing could spark such venom. However, I am not about to support someone who blatantly tries to disrupt my flow. My next 10-12 books are coming out regardless. My movies and television shows are happening regardless as well. Again, thanks for responding to my question.
Peace,
Zane |
Carey
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Carey
Post Number: 470
Registered: 05-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, March 16, 2005 - 05:38 pm: |
|
Hello Zane
Thanks for dropping in. It appears to me like two or three issues are on the table. I think it goes without saying that it shouldn't matter if a business of any kind does not care for or even totally dislikes a product they are selling. Look at a busness that sells beer our wine along with their gas or food products. They might not drink themselves yet they are selling the product to make money. As far as books are concern I am sure there are books in every bookstore that the own dislikes but of course they are going to sell them. However I think you mentioned someone wanting sort of a favor from you. Lets look at it like this. Are we talking about your product or you as a person. If they said they hated "Zane" the person than hell no, don't be asking for anything other than my truck to pull up and unload some books. But if your appearance is going to help them sell YOUR books than yes sir buddy talk whatever you want to about my product but get me a bigger purse or safty deposit box so that I can stuff it full of all this money. I think a person's opinion is a moot point, that's ego mess. If we can divide the person from the product, that's what the games about. Hey, some people refuse to read a person because they don't like the person. That's some silly mess but you know it happens. If a person bad mouths my product but wants me to take a piece of the pie than chatter on and pass the plate. Black bookstores or green ones, it shouldn't matter. I know it's hard to let someone make money off of you that has talked trash about ya, but I'd consider where my anger should be placed and try to get by that. I would assume the first response or reaction is to tell the trash talker to kiss your ass and get out of my face but once the emotions run their course I think one would stop and say, thank god I am the popular author and not the owner of the bookstore and open the door sucker, sit that book up right and let's make some money fool. Then Zane I'd laugh my ass off as I left the store and told him not to forget to turn out the lights, am outta here.
Carey |
Troy
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Troy
Post Number: 236
Registered: 01-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, March 17, 2005 - 09:32 am: |
|
Zane:
If there is a book seller who has publicly denounced your work and has asked you to do a signing. I would do the signing. You must make a distinction between a bookseller's personal opinion about an author's work and their function as a book seller. If the book seller's goal is to have a successful business they will have no problem making that distinction, nor should you. This is not being hypocritical -- it is being honest. Although we could probably all use more discretion when, where and how we choose to exercise our honesty.
I bet if you did the signing, the bookstore owner would be less inclined to share negative opinions about your work pubic ally -- and of course this is really the issue. If a book store owner truly disliked you and your work, you would not be offered the opportunity to sign.
Unless the book store owner is solely mission driven there is no way she or he will like every book that they sell. Indeed, they may actually hate some of the books they sell -- but if these books are selling well, the store owner will most likely promote these books (perhaps hosting an author's signing), despite their personal feelings.
Of course in the real world almost all independent book sellers are at least partially mission driven -- this is why they(we) are willing to struggle so hard to make a buck and do something that we think is right; contributing to the culture, promoting literacy, etc, etc. This is also the reason why these "semi-mission" driven bookstore owners may be willing to bash something that makes they money -- it is not solely about the money.
A rational bookstore owner would not invite you into their turf if they had a real beef with you personally. The store owner is trying to meet the needs of their customers; the reader -- which is your goal too.
As you know I'm a book seller in both the virtual and physical space. Five of your books occupy the top 10 spots of my bestseller's list. As a bestseller, your book may be found on our homepage as well. I promote these books based upon popularity not my personal opinion. I sell books that Thumper or another reviewer has completely trashed. However I also promote and sell books that will never make me money.
I wish I had time to read a 10th of the books I wanted to read. Perhaps I could then hop on the book bashing train too ;-)
|
Literarylicense
Newbie Poster
Username: Literarylicense
Post Number: 14
Registered: 02-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, March 17, 2005 - 09:55 am: |
|
I, for one, would sign my books at a store that openly didn't like my writing. And I will tell you why:
I sign books for my readers, not store owners and I want to make sure the readers have access to me.
Ultimately, signing books equates to more books sold and the increase attention to my book. I will kill two birds with one stone: Meet my readers and create exposure.
I guess if I were selling as much as Zane, then perhaps I would have a choice in the matter. But for now, I have to think about what works for me.
|
Thumper
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Thumper
Post Number: 386
Registered: 01-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, March 17, 2005 - 10:00 pm: |
|
Hello All,
Zane: Hey there. *sheepishly grinning* I owe Zane a favor and I haven't done it yet. So, I'm trying to look all innocent when I know I'm not. *big smile*
As far as the trash talking bookstore owner dogging you out publicly, I wouldn't give the MFs the time of day. Let's be real up in here a minute now: the thing is Zane would be doing the bookstore owner the favor. An author of popularity could pull up a lawn chair on a corner and have people lined up around the block, which is why a black bookstore owner, Hell any bookstore owner would want to have Zane's face up in their place. Because not only would the bookstore be selling Zane's books, but other titles as well. So, no, any black bookstore owner would literally be cutting off his nose to spite his face.
Now, that's not to say that the store owner don't have the right to voice his opinion or say what he likes or don't like, he/she does. But, there is something of decency, or the basic level of respect for the people he/she expects to make his money off of. Now, I realize that many of these people believe that they are getting plenty of PR that they ordinarily wouldn't have gotten due to the eyes of the publishing industry looking at the type of books we are buying. But what they are not seeing is the high failure rate of black bookstores. They need all the friends they can get, cause now its down to survival. Running the risk of pissing off authors like Zane, and you don't shit where you eat.
Troy wrote: "I sell books that Thumper or another reviewer has completely trashed. However I also promote and sell books that will never make me money."
Yeah, Troy what's up with THAT!? *LOL* To let everyone know, Troy has not once asked me to say that I liked a book when I didn't, or read a book that I didn't want to, even though there are times when it would have been a big plus for the site. |
Yvettep
Veteran Poster
Username: Yvettep
Post Number: 59
Registered: 01-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, March 18, 2005 - 09:00 am: |
|
"But what they are not seeing is the high failure rate of black bookstores. They need all the friends they can get, cause now its down to survival. Running the risk of pissing off authors like Zane, and you don't shit where you eat."
That's it, Thumper: Bottom line. Independent bokstores all over are struggling. Independently-owned anything for that matter...
I spoke before about how do we nurture African American writers, readers, agents, etc. We could add "bookstore owners" (bricks-and-mortar ones as well as on-line ones). I'm sure it's a delicate balance--"nurturing" and encouraging while also offering legitimate and constructive critique. But if we can't do that for each other, no one else will.
I have found the reviews here, on the whole, to be somewhere right in that balance.
|
Jmho
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Jmho
Post Number: 118
Registered: 03-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, March 20, 2005 - 10:59 am: |
|
Zane wrote:
It is a two-way street.
I most certainly agree, however would you prefer that your books to not be sold in a store where the store owner has "denounced" you, over and over? Aren't appearances by the author mainly for the readers/customers? And, as you indicate, this swings both ways. Just as the store owner is making money selling your books then so are you making money off the books the store owner sells, his or her personal opinion of your works, notwithstanding.
Then Carey wrote:
However I think you mentioned someone wanting sort of a favor from you.
An author deciding to sign books, in a store, may be seen as a favor to the owner, but it also allows the author to make money, too. So, it can also be seen as a favor rendered by the store owner to the author. Both entities can profit from such an arrangement. I would think, as you alluded, if I felt very strongly about this, and thought it was solely personal, and then I'd try my best to discontinue having any of my books to be sent to that bookstore for sale. My readers can get the books from many other outlets. If you got principles, then by all means, firmly stand on them.
Carey also wrote:
Lets look at it like this. Are we talking about your product or you as a
person.
I think this is a very astute observation. Obviously, some folks can't make the separation. Interestingly enough, some are able to put personal feelings aside and handle business, as it usually benefits everyone involved -- the store owner, the author and the customer. The same folks who think it shouldn't be personal usually are the ones who can do as much personalizing themselves. |
Mjlore
Newbie Poster
Username: Mjlore
Post Number: 7
Registered: 03-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, March 21, 2005 - 09:49 pm: |
|
If the bookstore owner trashes your book in public and then wants you to do a signing - charge him or her for the signing!
Or, trash talk their store!
Hell, you would never step on a door mat if it were to ever speak up! If it hollered, "watch out B-tch! You'd jump back and scream. You'd walk in the house through the back door before you'd step on that mat again!
Bookstores need authors - perhaps more than authors need them. But, in a perfect world authors and bookstores would support each other. However, it's not a perfect world. So if the owner says you're books are nasty - inform him (her) that his (her) azz is nasty but they still carry it around proudly and they don't talk trash it - because it's necessary!
That's the way I see it!
|
|
Email This Page