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ABM
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, June 17, 2003 - 03:13 pm: | 
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I just finished reading The Coldest Winter Ever by the well-known social activist Sistah Souljah. The book was fair-2-good. The pacing was solid, sometimes even compelling. But there were some lapses in plausibility. And the main character was so morally bereft, it was difficult to garner/maintain any genuine concern for her well-being.
But what was most disappointing to me about Winter was the book seemed to really lack emotional depth, especially in regards for feminine compassion/empathy. I honestly suspect this book was ghost written by a man. |
NeeCee48204
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, June 17, 2003 - 03:41 pm: |
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I found the Coldest Winter Ever to be fascinating; it was one of those rare books whereas the main character is not sympathetic yet I still enjoyed the story and the writing.
Can't wait for the sequel. |
Chris Hayden
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, June 17, 2003 - 03:46 pm: |
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ABM:
Kola--I mean Snake Girl-- thought you had quit--give a holla. |
Snake Girl
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, June 17, 2003 - 06:07 pm: |
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Hi Chris,
I really loved "Coldest Winter Ever". Of all the new "ghetto street books"...this one was actually literature and art. I despised the lead character and was glad to see her be the focus of the book, because she speaks to so much that is vile in the new generation of Bling-Bling kids, male and female alike.
Of course, it would take a sociologist to point out the reasons why.
After reading Souljah's other master work, her memoirs--"No Disrespect" (Random House)--you would not doubt that she wrote "Coldest Winter Ever". Her style is perfect, because it DOES leave cheap emotion and feminine indulgence at the door. I try hard to do the same in my own writing, although Soulja and I are two completely different type of artists.
I have named Berniece McFadden, Z.Z. Packer, Zadie Smith and A.J. Verdelle as the "new black women's writers" for the future canon. But let us also be aware that Sister Soulja is to the Hip Hop Revolution...what Zora Hurston was to the Harlem Renaissance.
Sister Soulja is IMPORTANT.
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ABM
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, June 18, 2003 - 11:49 am: |
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Kola/NeeCee,
I agree The Coldest Winter Ever ("Coldest") author Sistah Souljah has genuine writing talent. Like you both said, Souljah was able to skillfully craft a moderately riveting tale (of +400 pages) that featured a boldly unrepentant, unsympathetic female lead "Winter". Actually, I think Souljah's true writing skilz may lie in writing mysteries/thrillers, because she appears to know how to keep a story moving along (Emperor of Ocean Park author Stephen Carter should consult with Souljah about story pacing). And her insight, energy & candor make her a natural essayist and social commentator.
But it is hard for me to read a book about a teenage girl who in a day loses everything and everyone in her life and not want to feel some sympathy for her (I guess that's just me being the dad of newly-minted pubescent daughter.).
When I was done with the Coldest, I was left with the suspicion Souljah is angry with girls like Winter not just because of what they do, but what they represent (She maybe even on some level jealous of them.). I don't think it is a coincidence that Winter is light-complexioned (I think.) with naturally straight hair. I think the dark, squat Souljah may have been "hatin" lil' bit on the FOINE lite-brite sistahs who got the choice neighborhood ballahs when she was comin' up, and she used Coldest to exact a bit of literary payback to dem hi-yella heffahs. Otherwise, Souljah would have provided a fairer, more empathetic viewpoint of Winter.
I agree Winter was a due a comeuppance. But it would have been more authentic, more instructive, if she had at least 1 - 2 qualities that could have provided Winter with a remote possibility of salvation. Maybe if Winter had a teacher she really liked, a great hobby or skill she regularly enjoyed practicing, 1 could see how if she just made the right decisions about what was available to her, she could avoid ending up like her hapless parents. Even Winter's considerable fashion/style senses, which could have been presented as a possible pathway to an honest/successful life, was negatively eschewed toward petty feminine self-glorification and venality.
If Souljah wanted to use Winter's troublesome life as catalyst for change among young black women, she should have included in Coldest more chances for Winter to make more productive decisions. Every woman, no matter her situation and upbringing, has some redemptive qualities. But the problem with making Winter so short on any positive qualities, Souljah makes it very difficult for other young AA women who's lives mirror Winter's to use Coldest as a tool to foresee, believe in and embrace positive solutions to their problems.
Simply, I think Souljah was trying to say, "Look you wannabe slick b$#ches! This is what happens to yur a$$es when you are too catty, vain, selfish, manipulative, greedy, materialistic and slutty." And I find that to be a worthy point to make. But I wonder given what limited materials Winter appeared to have to work with, how else was she to think/do?
But having said all that, I did enjoy The Coldest Winter Ever (& I think it deserves a sequel) and I look forward to reading more of Sistah Souljah's works as her knowledge and talents bloom. |
NeeCee
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, June 18, 2003 - 12:09 pm: |
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See, I didn't mind that Winter didn't have any redeeming qualities. I think that's real at times. Sometimes when people go through challenging experiences, they simply do not change for the better. Others become sober and turn their life around. To me, it's okay that there wasn't a happily ever after -- I'm guessing that the author is trying to send a message to the young ladies who want to exemplify Winter.
Souljah did a masterful job. It was glued to that book and wouldn't let it go until it was complete. But admittedly, when the book first came out, well, it didn't sound interesting. The cover wasn't compelling. But the word of mouth? Hey, I couldn't resist with such strong word of mouth.
Also, this novel has the distinction of having the highest number of reviews/comments for any 'black' novel on Amazon.com which might not mean much but to me it says a lot.
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NeeCee
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, June 18, 2003 - 12:12 pm: |
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Speaking of Sister Souljah, did any of you read her feature with Jada Pinkett in a recent Essence magazine. Jada was on the cover. Souljah's writing was like walking barefoot on sacred land.
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ABM
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, June 18, 2003 - 12:44 pm: |
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NeeCee,
I agree that few people change. Even when presented a calamitous situation, most of us refer to and rely upon that which is most familiar and comfortable to us, even if what we do can possibly get us into deeper doo-doo.
But as I finished Coldest, I'm thinking, ok Souljah, I get the point you are trying to make. But how was this girl to take even a minute step towards enlightenment? Since Winter was borne/bred into a dangerous, screw-or-be-screwed lifestyle, I tried to think what would I do, how would I feel were I her. What if I were a young inner city female, who was cater to all my life, who never had to handle my business, who was the "Miss It" of the block, who suddenly had EVERTHING taken from me and I had no discernable skills. I don't think that was fully and fairly communicated in the book.
And I'm not saying the story should have had a happy ending. And I applaud Souljah for not reverting to that trite literary boilerplate "Happily Ever After" ending. I just wish there had been more legitimate situations, dilemmas where Winter had a chance to do good and just simply chose to f$#K up.
But again, I agree the pacing of Coldest was solid. And even though it was steeped in the specific, bawdy vernacular of the East Cost Inner City (circa 1990's), the narration was concise and storyline was clear, which made the book easy to follow and enjoy. |
Snake Sister
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, June 18, 2003 - 01:45 pm: |
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ABM...you referred to Sister Souljah as "squat, dark and jealous" because light-brite girls got all the men when she was younger.
Have you ever seen any of her music videos from the days before she was a wife and mother?
I don't know too many women of any color who could compete with her naturally beautiful face...long NATURAL Indian-mixed hair...and totally killer body.
Haven't you read her book "No Disrespect?" or is it just her dark skin and the fact that she has outspoken POLITICS that makes you envision her as...."squat, dark and jealous"?
What woman could you possibly be talking about?
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Snake Girl
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, June 18, 2003 - 02:14 pm: |
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Also, don't forget, ABM...Black male "ballers" will drop that lite-brite "good haired" colored girl for an AUTHENTIC white woman quicker than you can say..."plantation".
So "jealousy" seems to me like a simplification of a much larger issue in Souljah's work.
Racism and the way it now divides us by even our FLESH is more to the point.
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Yukio
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, June 18, 2003 - 02:48 pm: |
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Nice exchange, and I wish I could participate, but i haven't read the book.
Kola:
What is your email address? I want to share something with you. |
akaivyleaf
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, June 18, 2003 - 03:50 pm: |
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Hummmmm,
Until I read ABM's post I had not considered the points he raised. I do not think that Sistah Souljah has a color complex. I'm like snake girl, I find her beautiful and she epitimizes something that Winter wouldn't have a clue about from her portrayal in the book.
I found "The Coldest Winter Ever" to be a very symbolic title. Winter had not one redeeming quality that I would want any child to emulate. She was very cold and totally void of love, or happiness, and wasn't equipped to even dream of such. I felt a well placed whipping most appropriate for her but because she didn't hail from that type of disiplinary environment, she was total void of anything akin to a decent child. Well maybe not a whipping, but parents that cared enough about her well being to discipline her. Sadly, this is highly accurate in some of the children and teens that I've had the misfortune of being around. For this accurate portrayal, Souljah gets high marks with me.
I didn't like her interjecting herself into the book, I thought that was a little self serving.
Thanks for the thoughts ABM, I'll have to think of the book in terms of your post and reply more later. |
ABM
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, June 18, 2003 - 04:28 pm: |
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Enjoy the water, Ms. Pink-n-Green. But be careful about which end of the stream that you dive into. 'Cause brothahman likes to swim far and...deep. |
Snake Girl
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, June 18, 2003 - 04:39 pm: |
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Yukio, you can email me at kolamask@yahoo.com
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ABM
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, June 18, 2003 - 04:51 pm: |
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Hey, ladies. I am not indicting Souljah of any wrongdoing. I personally look forward to reading more of her works. All I'm just saying let's look a little deeper at not only "what" Souljah wrote but also "why" she may have done it. Try as we might, we all harbor our little prejudices & preferences. And I think if Souljah are going to publicly present yourself as some symbol or standard for others to follow, she'd better be ready to handle a few bards & brick bracks heaved at her.
I'm not sure of Souljah harboring some color thang. I don't know enuff personally about her definitively assert that she's "color-struck" (as my grandma used to say) And I am wholly unaware of Souljah's premarital dimensions as Kola refer to. But I thought it worth noting since beauty, skin color and hair texture are such prominent bones-of-contention among ALL black women, US/abroad. Simply, if the story was intended to open the curtain to black women as a whole, I thought it to be worth asking why would Souljah choose to make the Winter fair complexioned with naturally straight hair.
BTW: akaivyleaf, I too thought it cheesy of her to so aggressively use the book to market her public speaking career (That's got her benefactor P. Diddy (then "Puffy" Combs) written all over it). |
Daniecia
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, June 18, 2003 - 05:18 pm: |
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Wazzup ABM,
I had an opposite reaction to yours about the book.
Winter's mother was a glamorous beautiful shallow "darkskinned" beauty--remember? She was even more pathetic and golddigging than her daughter.
There was a friend of Winter's who was fat and darkskinned with braids. She was two-faced and couldn't be trusted, remember?
Then there was a nasty darkskinned Jamaican woman in the book with serious attitude.
I had always thought that Souljah was expressing disdain for the darker sistas. LOL
Also, my brotha, you say that beauty/skin color and hair texture is a bone of contention between all black women everywhere.
The real fact is that those issues are created by Black men and their decades old love affair with the lightest, brightest, closest to whitest women they can find. This is one reason why I always appreciated Kola's bravery in speaking up and at the risk of being disliked for being honest on the subject. Let's face it, black men do praise and honor the looks of lighterskinned or light brown women, unanimously, and do tend to ignore and reject darkskinned women. I can't think of, off the top of my head, a movie with a dark colored female as the romantic lead. I did notice Jaheim's recent music video however has a dark beauty as the star so maybe the complaining is starting to bring about change.
Where I live in Oregon, you see black men married mostly to white women, Asian, latin and mixed race black women. Sometimes a yellow woman with nappy hair, but never ever a black woman who looks like say Angela Bassett. Not ever. My church is crawling with sweet, very pretty dark brown women who never get asked for dates and in fact out here people, mainly black men and white women, avoid eye contact with a dark skinned woman.
I do notice that if you bring this issue up, black men and lightskinned women become furious and accuse you of being racist. Black men will even claim that there are no good dark women and that all dark women are jealous, unattractive and materialistic. They seem to be blind to the same qualities in women are not black.
I am a lightskinned girl with nappy hair and even I have trouble getting a brothas attention here in Portland. They are literally prejudiced against black women. The whole West Coast is like that, so I'm planning to move east after I finish school. I know where Kola lives in California, it's even worse than Oregon!
This prejudice that millions of brothas have against black women with natural hair and dark skin is what causes the tension between different shades of black women, because even when a dark skin woman rolls her eyes at me because I am lightskin, she does not realize that a brotha will shove me out of the way for a Mexican girl.
The lighter the female, the more black men react favorably. And let me tell you. Those white and Mexican women out here are the most materialistic, nasty attitude "Queens" you ever want to see. But black men only see them as perfect.
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sisgal
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, June 18, 2003 - 07:49 pm: |
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I read Coldest some years ago, when it was first released and before I had heard anything about it. I saw Sister Souljah speaking in New Orleans. I remembered her from her videos and rap days, but the girl/woman blew me away with her incite and compassion. I purchased her book based on seeing her that day. The book was a welcome delight. While the trend of relationship books was overflowing, Sistah wrote something totally different, dark and intrigueing. However unlike most of you, despite Winters lack of any redeeming qualities I felt sorry for her and admired her at the same time. This girl was a survivor, make it or break it attitude was exciting and broke the mode of the wimpy woman. I don't want all my fiction to end up happy, hell sometimes life ain't happy. Thats why I fell in love with Bernice Faddens, Sugar. Sugar did what she had to do to survive, and she was very black and beautiful. I hear Sistah Souljah and Jada will be making this into an HBO movie, I just hope they choose the parts well. I also look forward to a sequel. Now the color issue, I don't see it, with regards to Souljah, maybe she was just reflecting what she sees. I agree Danecia, life on the darker side ain't peachy king! Our men talk "dark berry...sweet juice", but their choices and the ones that catch their eyes are always on the lighter side. I no stranger to the sun, it finds me even in the shade. But that's cool, I still shout with pride, black and beautiful, I have no choice, its the way God intended. |
Snake Girl
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, June 18, 2003 - 11:40 pm: |
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Amen Sisgal and thanks Daniecia. Thanks, too, ABM.
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Cynique
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, June 19, 2003 - 01:05 am: |
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I agree that "The Coldest Winter" was a riveting story but I don't share in the praise for Sista Soljah's writing style. Sometimes the first person narrator spoke in an ebonic street idiom and other times in intellectual philosophical prose. I found that this distracted from the authenticity of the character. She became a voice for the author and didn't stand on her own; she was two-dimensional rather than three. And, yes, I, too, could've done without the author intruding herself into the story line.
And here's something to spazz Snake Girl out. Since it's such an ongoing bone of contention that black women cannot argue about objectively, I recently decided to ask a white woman to give me her honest opinion as to why men in general, and black men in particular are so enamoured of white or light-skinned woman. She thought about it moment and then said maybe it's because white represents purity and that since the sun is bright and golden, men in their primitive subconsciousness react to the personification of these qualities because they are associated with warmth and happiness and innocence. She was almost apologetic when stammering that was the only explanation she could come up with. I did remind her that recent studies showed that men have a primitive reaction to good facial symmetry because it was once a strong trait that boded well for motherhood.
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yukio
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, June 19, 2003 - 01:20 am: |
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Cynique:
There really isn't a such thing as objectivity; also many white folk are not conscious of their own history, so that these issues of beauty, race, and color, don't effect/affect them, because since they are the "normal," they often don't have to consider these issues, except, of course, those who desire to be blond, pointer noses, etc.....many jews and italians also dealt with issues of color and hair texture. I'm assuming, that all these elements are related. |
Yukio
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, June 19, 2003 - 01:23 am: |
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I've had this book for almost 6 months, and I have yet to read it.....u guys are making it more interesting.....I'll let another six months past, and then i'll read it! |
ABM
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, June 19, 2003 - 12:10 pm: |
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Ladies,
I was 1/2 joking about Souljah being envious of yellow women. Although, it's interesting how that the mere mentioning of that subject can rile up the sistahs like few other issues can.
I could go on, and on, and on ........................................................................about how sistahs are equally culpable of what separates black men/women. Hell, I have done that very thing here several times. But I guess I will should resign my thoughts/comments to the probability that with respect to the issue of interracial relations, brothahs/sistahs see the world is almost diametrically opposed viewpoints. Both sides want to blame the other and neither want to accept any responsibility themselves.
Of course there are lots of men lusting after non-black women. But I know statistically they are much fewer in number/percentage than many black women assert. My stats say that fewer than 9% of married black men have non-black wives, and a high percentage those who change racial teams are military men who often spend a higher % of time around non-white women than do other brothers.
I do agree with you that you should leave the West Coast as soon as you are done with your studies. There are just too many folks out there who are living blond hair, blue eyed California dreams out there. But I think you (& Kola) are mistakenly using what you are observing on the Pacific Coast to overestimate the degree and frequency of interracial coupling nationwide. You just don't see nearly as much two-toned cuddling in the Midwest, South and East as you do on the Left Coast.
Frankly, I am AMAZED by how the very women who birth/raise black boys can wholly divorce themselves of responsibility of how those men determine what and who they do. If the black woman/mother is so mighty and wondrous as advertised, wouldn't brothahs prefer to mate with what promises to maintain and enrich their existence?
How can you black women be so smart, brave, strong and independent in so many other areas of your life yet quake helplessly at the ignorant behest of us woefully lesser males? |
sisgal
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, June 19, 2003 - 01:09 pm: |
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So partial are men as to expect brick where they afford no straw.
we just love yall, sometimes stupidly so. |
Cynique
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, June 19, 2003 - 03:29 pm: |
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Hi Yukio,
I agree that what my white acquaintance had to say could hardly be considered objective. And guess what else? My reading interest has been suddenly revived thanks to this intriguing best-selling mystery I've just started. I can hardly put "The Da Vinci Code" down! (Like Thumper, I've made a quick detour into the winter wonderland.)
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ABM
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, June 19, 2003 - 04:20 pm: |
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sisgal: So partial are men as to expect brick where they afford no straw.
ABM: How dare you hope to mate a King yet can not weave a Crown? |
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