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Troy
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, April 25, 2003 - 10:56 pm: | 
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The Sisters of APF: The Indoctrination of Soror Ride Dick (where APF stands for Alpha Phi Fuckem)
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0743466985/aalbccom-20
Below is email thread I winessed. This is also how I learned about Zane's latest.
Message 1
Can this title be right!
Message 2
Odd title. Porn moves into the mainstream.
Message 3
"The new standard for Black lit."<br>
Is porn moving into the mainstream? I believe there is certainly a place for pornography, but are we actually witnessing pornography becoming the standard "The new standard for Black lit." or literature in general.
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Chris Hayden
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, April 26, 2003 - 10:12 am: |
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Troy:
Zane is not porn. Zane is erotica. I read the short story upon which this is based. It was rauncy, funny, outrageous and profane--but not pornographic.
I think she is touching on areas already long touched on--in works as diverse as those of John Edgar Wideman to Iceberg Slim. The "art" of even mainstream, bestseller works has become a lot more frank, with four letter words and variious grapplings and couplings. I can't wait to see what Cynique and Kola Boof throw up heah! |
Troy
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, April 26, 2003 - 01:52 pm: |
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Hey Chris:
Were you sexually aroused by the story? Do you think someone else could have been? Do you think the author's intent was to arouse sexual feelings?
From Merriam-Webster
Pornography
1: the depiction of erotic behavior (as in pictures or writing) intended to cause sexual excitement
2: material (as books or a photograph) that depicts erotic behavior and is intended to cause sexual excitement
erotica
1: literary or artistic works having an erotic theme or quality
where erotic is defined as:
1: of, devoted to, or tending to arouse sexual love or desire <erotic>
2: strongly marked or affected by sexual desire
Given these definitions and my own working knowledge I'm having dificulty understanding how you distinqush "erotica" from "pornography" in this case. Porn is clearly erotic, so why can't erotica be pornographic? Why do you think Zane's Work is not pornographic?
When I first visited Zane's site and read some of her short stories and discussion boards, they easily fit into Merriam's definition of pornography and erotica -- the two are not mutually exclusive.
I've only read an except that Simon and Shuster ecently sent. It was neither erotic or pornographic. So I can't even begin to judge this particular book. I'm only examining the title.
The title which should give you some insight into the direction the book will take. So when I read a title which says "The Sisters of APF: The Indoctrination of Soror Ride Dick (where APF stands for Alpha Phi Fuckem)" I expecting some action baby!
Given the fact that the book was published by S&S's "Adult Publishing Group" and some of Zanes other works "Getting Buck Wild: Sex Chronicles 2" and the "Heat Seekers", I doubt if I'll be disappointed if I'm looking for the "depiction of erotic behavior" (Read: Porn).
To call this stuff non-pornographic is simply playing word games.
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Cynique
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, April 26, 2003 - 04:32 pm: |
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Sometimes a distinction is made between erotica and porno by characterizing erotica as "aesthetic" and porno as "smut". But, obviously, this depends on whose making the judgment, Hugh Hefner or Larry Flynt. LOL |
Kola
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, April 26, 2003 - 05:47 pm: |
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Hi Chris.
I'm penning a book of erotic short stories for 2006.
The editor who asked me to put it together is now upset that I won't budge on the title--
which is "COMING HOME".
The book is really about need, selfishness and being bored.
I love sex (because I'm young) and let's face it--how could sexy Kola not be having sex? (**with her kid's father ONLY)...but I agree with Maya Angelou's observation that "sensuality" and the sensual life of nature...is a great deal sexier...than SEX itself.
I think my erotic prose is far more explicit and borderline pornographic than what ZANE writes.
I like her books (for escapism), and as I told her--one of her books caused my second son to be conceived....but her titles are never quite interesting to me. Ditto for the new one. I wouldn't buy a book titled that...UNLESS I KNEW...that Zane had written it. And then, too, her books aren't really "dangerous" or even erotic--you know. She's a black Jackie Collins/Pat Beach without the pretense.
The hard thing about writing erotica for me...is that I'm an exhibitionist and a person from a culture where sexuality is part of religion...(for instance, many people believe that Prophet Ciisa--[Jesus Christ]--had plenty of sex when he was alive on earth)...so it can be difficult to gage how to tantilize people without offending them morally--America is a "victorian-based" society--meaning [sexually repressed--WHITE].
And as for Troy (who's absolutely elated that I'm posting here)...I think there is a difference between erotica and porno.
I think in porno...that icky gooey stuff squirts out all over everybody and people lap it up. I HATE THAT! Men would be perfect creatures if they didn't have to have that stuff coming out. THAT'S PORNO to me.
With Erotica...you just get the moans and groans of two people's imagination--exploring sensuality together.
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Bayou Lights
Rating: 
Votes: 1 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, April 27, 2003 - 01:07 am: |
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All--
I've yet to read a Zane novel but the author generates a lot of discussion. I'll try and pick up one soon.
There's a fine line between erotica/porn but isn't the difference in the artistry of the language and the telling. Erotica, in my opinion, draws on more than just the act itself and in ways that bring the reader to a larger realization, or insight into the characters.
I feel like I can speak on this more once I've read Zane, but I used to subscribe to Lily Pond: The literary journal of erotica and there was always something in the submitted pieces that spoke to the mind and not just the body.
In your opinion, Troy, does Zane bring that element to the storytelling.
Bayou |
Brian Egeston
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, April 27, 2003 - 11:21 pm: |
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Come on, now. We aren’t really having this discussion, are we? About Zane writing porn or erotica? Come on let’s get really real here. Why does it matter? The publishing industry is filled hardback whores, and paperback pimps anyway. Writers go out on the market(street corner). Bring back the money from sales(tricking). If writers don’t bring back enough money from the street, then writers get pimp-slapped(no royalties).
So why does it matter that someone writes a book that their child can’t take to class to share with other students even though that same book is putting food on the table?
Come on, now. Let’s get plain up in here. If Zane doesn’t write it, someone else will and someone else will buy them...lots of them.
I wrote an “erotic” story for the After Hours collection which featured two characters who were heterosexual, married, in love, and sexually in line with God’s plan. Do you think people read the story because they thought they were gonna get some Christian Erotica? Heeeeck no. They bought it because they wanted to read stories about sex, sexuality, intimacy...and a frog.
Come on Troy, why are talking about this in an industry that lives and dies by reading trends, exploitation, and GREED(had to get that in) ? Are we actually having a morality discussion about the book business?
If someone is actually concerned about the morality of Black books, then maybe they should examine the issues of the characters within the story, such as the husband in Addicted having to watch his parent perform sex acts or the wife in Addicted being molested as a child. Then one might explore the generational sins and curses that infect the mind through porno. Then one might explore the impact of Zane’s books, instead of the books' actual production. (Don’t think that I’m promoting or condoning the subject matter.) It’s not an issue of selling sex books. That won’t stop...ever. Margaret Mitchell, author of Gone with the Wind, used to read erotic short stories with her husband in bed.
Come on now. We aren’t really talking about morality, books, and money are we?
Oh by the way. Someone posted that men would me perfect if we didn’t “squirt” If men didn’t “squirt” women wouldn’t be here and vice versa. That act is merely one half of one of the most beautiful miracles on earth which no writer, no matter how talented or inspired, could have created on their own.
Written With Warmth,
Brian Egeston
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Cynique
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, April 27, 2003 - 11:55 pm: |
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Brian Egeston:
I didn't get the impression that Troy or anyone else was offended or shocked by the emergence of porn/erotica in mainstream literature. Troy was just posing some questions. Your remarks, although interesting, were irrelevant. It's presumptous of you to think that we are all naive. |
Chris Hayden
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, April 28, 2003 - 10:29 am: |
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Troy:
The only differences I can see in the Webster's definition of Porn and Erotic is that the aim of Porn is to arouse sexual EXCITEMENT and the aim of Erotica is to arouse LOVE or SEXUAL DESIRE.
Those may be so close as to not be worth debating. I understand that the definition of Pornography keep shiftting--Walt Whitman and James Joyce were once accused of it, and are now part of the literary canon. So it would in part depend on the standards of today, and we may be left up to the standard laid down by the Supreme Court Justice who allegedly said, "I don't know how to define it, but I know it when I see it."
In a large part it will be a subjective measure.I was invited to write some erotica so I did some research. I found that Pornography is more male friendly, the act is often viewed comedically and a dominance dynamic is geared to the male. It will depend on physical descriptions of the female as mostly sex machine (almost always with huge breasts) and tend to feature what we call hard core acts such as bondage, sadism, erotic use of waste products, bestiality, cannibalism, necrophilia, rape, sexual murder(snuff films) , satanism, vampirism, and the like. Stuff that is X rated, that can't even be mentioned in a G-rated setting.
Erotica is more woman friendly: it will have a female protagonist usually and often the sex takes place in a romantic situation and you don't have the X-rated sexual pratices mentiioned above. Maybe a little spanking, but not no hard core mutilation and torture.
By the way, I found the Zane story funny. I find her stuff more funny than anything else. I have never been particularly aroused by erotic writings. I have admired them for their artistry--I mean, it's almost like a wrestling match. The writer has to work with the same thing, and after going around the world, where else can you take the readers? Perhaps movies, cable strip clubs and DA REAL THANG have spoiled me. |
Brian Egeston
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, April 28, 2003 - 10:25 pm: |
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Cynique,
Thanks for taking the time to post a response to my comments. May God continue to bless you.
Sincerely Scribed,
Brian Egeston
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Cynique
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, April 28, 2003 - 11:48 pm: |
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Well, Brian, allow me to observe that you're a "gentleman and a scholar". |
Crystal
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, April 29, 2003 - 06:31 pm: |
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I don't think the problem is with books like Zane's. When you pick up one of her books you most likely know what you're in for. What I don't like is these authors who either can't write or are so busy cranking out crap just for the money that they stick porn in their stories that doesn't contribute to the story at all. And some of it gets pretty graphic. It's like they are just trying to find something to fill up the space between the covers. Maybe it's for the sensational factor, although porn has become so commonplace everywhere we look there's nothing sensational about it. It's happening more and more lately and I don't like it! |
Tee C. Royal
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, April 29, 2003 - 11:45 pm: |
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Troy...one question for you. Have you read The Sisters of APF or any of Zane's work or is your question below based upon what you've already read or simply heard about Zane's writing?
-Tee
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Troy asked:
Is porn moving into the mainstream? I believe there is certainly a place for pornography, but are we actually witnessing pornography becoming the standard "The new standard for Black lit." or literature in general.
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Kola
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, April 30, 2003 - 01:57 am: |
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I like Zane's books, actually.
I don't think they're pornographic. Troy's an old man I think (LOL).
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akaivyleaf
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, May 01, 2003 - 05:42 pm: |
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I most certainly concur with you, Crystal. Zane shoots it straight (no pun intended) and other authors add it as incentive to get the reader to buy the book, when often times the story would be better told without its inclusion.
Zane is doing her thing and making waves in the literary world and the niche' fits. Lets praise her for her strides in the book industry instead of debating about whether or not she's moving some defininition of porn into the mainstream.
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ABM
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, May 01, 2003 - 08:24 pm: |
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I have not read "The Indoctrination of Soror Ride Dick". But I have read enuff of Zane's works to know that, although they are well-written and enjoyable, they certainly could be deemed pornographic. When you use the p-words and d-words with the frequency and in the manner that she so eloquently does, you have admit her works often falls within the pornographic realm. Much of her stuff would fit comfortably within Hustler, Penthouse, etc. (not that I regularly scan those rags, mind you).
The reason why some of you argue her works aren't porno is that the author is a black female and, thus, many of you view the audacity of her writing via some sexual liberation prism.
Still, I enjoy reading pornography from a female perspective. There is something especially alluring about witnessing a woman's literary fantasies of wanton sexual delights. |
Tee C. Royal
Rating: 
Votes: 1 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, May 02, 2003 - 09:41 am: |
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akaivyleaf, I'm with you on this one...Zane is definitely making waves and others are trying to follow in her footsteps. I personally don't see her work as pornographic...and I don't have a problem with a character able to express themselves sexually (or a person for that matter). I've never been intimidated with my sexuality...perhaps this is why I like her work.
Another thing I like is that she has the ability to write outside of the box (I've seen some of her non-erotic pieces) as well as get across themes that I believe some people miss as they lose themselves in the erotic scenes.
And we won't talk about the business-woman side of Ms. Zane. She's absolutely BUSINESS-SAVVY, yet, she's always willing to help aspiring and newly published authors out.
As far as the title...I did think she was joking when she told our group, she definitely has guts, but what does that say about the industry? ROFL. I read the Sisters of APF back in January and with the exception of a few things that I simply don't condone, I thought the book was wonderful and my 4.5 rating holds still. Feel free to check out my review on Amazon or at:
http://www.therawreviewers.com/TRR/Reviews/SistersofAPF.htm
Bottom line is that ZANE is a hot commodity and if you don't believe me check out the #85 sales rank slot she's holding on Amazon.com. I say, you go gurl, ^5, and hurry up with Nervous (my favorite of the bunch).
No, I don't consider her writing literary, but I'm a fan for life and will read everything she writes. I'll have to find the link to a short story that she wrote a few years back that was very touching and had NO sexual implications...
Oh, one more thing...pick up APF in the stores and check out the covers. I think it's cool how they have another cover underneath the dust jacket as I don't recall seeing this done before.
-Tee C. Royal
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Susan
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, May 02, 2003 - 09:53 am: |
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Hello all,
I've read her work and would classify such as pornographic. And, I *don't* have problem with my sexuality or anyone else's. For me, one has nothing to with the other.
Concerning her writing something other than what's been published, I look forward to read these published works in the future.
Susan |
Chris Hayden
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, May 02, 2003 - 12:52 pm: |
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ABM:
I don't think you know what pornography is. It is more than a matter of curse words and it is not because the author is a woman. I am a man. John Edgar Wideman, Allen Ginsberg, Amiri Baraka use p words and d words and are not viewed as pornography.
You need to view some of the hard core stuff featuring, beastiality, snuff, rape, bondage, S&M, eating of and spraying of partners and nmodels with waste products and you'll see what I mean.
I live in St. Louis MO. Yesterday I walked about two miles to a social service agency where I spent the day. Afterward I rode with a friend to St. Louis County where we visited three shopping centers. In the whole time I saw one black person reading a book--a woman, and she was reading something by Zane. She was reading it openly and in public. I have heard that people read her books on the NY subway all the time.
Porn is strictly brown bag stuff. Are you a woman or a man, ABM? I ask because I know the brothers have some trouble with a woman cussing and speaking frankly on sexual matters.
Outmoded ideas about how a woman ought to be ladylike (while a man can be nasty as he wannabe)--Sauce for the goose is sauce for the gandaer. Spend some time sitting around a beauty shop. You'll have your ears and eyes opened. |
Kola
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, May 02, 2003 - 02:21 pm: |
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Chris, I agree with you.
Last night, Thomas and I went to the home of some black friends in Chino Hills (an upper class group). The subject of Winnie Mandela came up...and everyone was berating her for "allegedly" having had sex with other men during the 40 years that Mandela was in prison.
Well...I pissed everybody off (as usual) by pointing out that we would not expect a man to wait 40 years for 1 female to get out of prison so that he could have sex...I found it ludicrous that a woman should be expected to abstain from sex for 4 decades. I said that Winnie could STILL love her husband completely and yet have sex with other men while the husband was locked away.
You've never seen such "victorianism" and "sexism" from the partygoers. They were so idiotic to me. IMAGINE...dying with all that respectability.
Anyway, Thomas almost slapped me across the face when I informed them that I hired out a co-wife for him during my second pregnancy. THEY LOOKED AT ME LIKE I WAS TRASH. And I just don't get it. Why should I be bothered with Thomas and "that thang" when I'm suffering from pregnancy? What's wrong with having a live-in co-wife for about 6 months? I KNOW HE LOVES ME ONLY...and two months after our son was born, I sent the Kima girl packing and gave her a reference letter for her Citizenship application.
I'm a busy woman. I have writing to do--I cook 3 meals every day. I was an activist in the Sudanese People's Liberation Army and then I don't trust maids--I have to clean my own house.
Sometimes, I don't understand American ways. And I don't think of ZANE as pornographic. I myself am writing an erotic fiction collection...my stuff is more graphic than hers. But then again, I have a lot of literary pieces coming out before that...so mines will probably be given a more fair appraisal and will probably be tied in, somehow, to my "womanism".
I think ZANE is great.
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Cynique
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, May 02, 2003 - 02:58 pm: |
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The discussion precipitated by ABM's remarks brings to mind the old Freudian "whore/madonna" concept which contends that every man wants a madonna in the household and a whore in the bed. And, as far as sexuality is concerned, apparently the double standard will remain firmly entrenched as long as women want to be put on a pedestal by their men.I haven't checked out any Zane yet, because I'd rather write erotica, than read it. (which means the book I'm currently writing is littered with it.) LOL
Regarding the broader discussion, I would think that when "perversion" is inserted into the equasion, that's where the fine line between porn and erotica comes into play, with porn getting the nod as the domain of unnatural acts. |
Troy
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, May 05, 2003 - 12:04 am: |
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Bayou Lights
I can't say that I've read enough of the genre to make the distinction you've described. There was a comedian (I wanna say Franklin Ajaye). Who use to say something like "Women say I think with my dick. I don't think with my dick my dick thinks for me". I say that to say that I may not be able to draw the distinct (smile).
Brian:
Your analogy was quite funny. I don't believe mainstream publishing is as immoral as you suggest.
Tee C.
The answer to your question, to me, is in my second post in this thread.
Chris
It sounds like ABM's definition of porn is simply more accurate than yours, unless you want to disagree with the dictionary. What does bestiality have to do with anything? You make it sound like porn has to be bad, nasty or degenerate.
Cynique
Seems like we are into some post-modernist discussion where meaning is a function of who is doing the interpretation. Can't there be be a defitntion of pormography/erotica that is not open to interpretation. For exmaple, suggesting the demarcation point for erotica to pornography is perversion. Some people consider relations between people of the same sex a perversion, so does that mean we can't have homosexual erotica? Like you said it depends upon who is making the judgment, "Hugh Hefner or Larry Flynt".
Kola:
I'm not sure I get the "who's absolutely elated that I'm posting here" comment, but I've not had a chance to read the posts for a while. As Cynique pointed out I was not making a value judgment, just making a comment about the title of a book, and using it as a lead in for the question we've been examining. As far as bringing another woman into the house -- hey whatever works you, but everything in your personal life does not does not need to be shared in public. Perhaps that is what angered Thomas. Perhaps I am an old man.
As far as Zane is concerned; while I used to title of her book as a spring board for this discussion, I have nothing against her personally. I meet her briefly last year and she had a very positive vibe. I have nothing against her. Shoot, I've recommended her book on my lastest newsletter. When I ride the subway perople are reading Zane. She has obviously created a body of work that people want to read, which is why she sells so many books.
Peace
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Sandra
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, May 05, 2003 - 01:07 am: |
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Addicted was great. I read it last summer on a beach trip..let's just say I was hot in more ways than one. I also enjoyed the stories in After Hours. I read a bit of erotica by other authors (AA and non-AA) and I never really thought that they might be considered porn..hmmmm.
As for her latest, (The Sisters of APF: The Indoctrination of Soror Ride Dick (where APF stands for Alpha Phi Fuckem), I must say I was taken aback by the title simply because I couldn't picture it on the shelf in my local Walmart or B&N --or sitting around my house in the open for my 10 yr. old to see. But I guess the excplicit title is not on the cover--am I right?
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Chris Hayden
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, May 05, 2003 - 10:23 am: |
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Troy:
The definition in the dictionary was so vague as to be useless--the difference between erotica and porn was almost nonexistent, which conniseurs (sp) or pervayors of same would be willing to note.
If you had a porn store and all you had was tapes of soaps operas and Playboy magazine you would go out of business. Porn IS nasty, bad and degenerate, which is its allure, which is why it is called Porn and why we don't show it on Prime Time Network TV or sell it at Blockbuster--of course, people who dig the golden showers or the Marquis De Sade might not think so--different strokes.
Erotica is kinder, gentler, and involves the graphic depiction of the sexual act in a more romantic setting. If you billed a site as erotica and featured snuff movies I would get a whole list of complaints.
I'm itching to post some URLS up here and let people decide, but this is a family site. |
Cynique
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, May 05, 2003 - 12:40 pm: |
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Troy,
I have to agree with Chris when he contends that porn and erotica are not interchangeable, that they are different degrees of sexual expression. Porn is hard core, erotica isn't.
I'll admit, however, that when I used the term "perversion" in reference to porn, I was being subjective. To me, "perversion" would be sex with animals or children. But others might, indeed, consider homosexuality a perversion. |
Tee C. Royal
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, May 06, 2003 - 06:20 pm: |
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Sandra, I can't remember, but I think the only thing on the cover is The Sisters of APF...I don't have an actual copy of the book yet. :-( And, I liked Addicted too...and am looking forward to the others in the series.
Chris/Cynique, I'm following you and I do agree...but I also know we have our own connotation of words and I'm okay with that.
Chris...you're funny. Let that itch go, but hit me up off list. Ahaha, just kidding... <grin>
-Tee |
Kola
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, May 06, 2003 - 10:59 pm: |
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Troy Johnson--
I think you should check out the thread called "Acting Out-Benilde Little"...since you haven't been keeping up lately.
Also, after the comments made on here by Time Magazine's Cornell Griffin (in the thread called "Negative Authors..."), I think it's best if I retreat and withdraw from this web site.
as you always say...
PEACE
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Troy
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, May 08, 2003 - 04:00 pm: |
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There was some supreme court justice who said in effect I can't define pornography for you, but I know when I see it.
It seems as far as the written word is concerned, what one person finds freaky another will find erotic, while another will find boring, and so on.
I guess it is really impossible to define a universally accepted standard for what can be called erotica and what can be called pornography.
I guess that is really part of the larger issue: The lack of standards. I did a search on the word "dick" on Amazon. Other than titles relating to Moby Dick, Dick and Jane or title which included the author's name who is Dick, I did not come across another title that used the word in the context of the male sex organ. I did not check all 775 titles, just enough to get an indication and the Dick is rarely used in book titles.
Is any word or phrase acceptable acceptable to use in a title? Is any subject off limits? How about a book called Sweet Little Thang: Older Men Share their Secrets on Attacking Pre-Pubescent Boys (fiction or non-fiction).
I'm not making a value judgement, just an observation. Fundamentally I believe one should be able to publish a book about anything they want. However, I also believe books in schools, and mainstream publishing should have some of standard in both quality and type of content.
Peace
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Cynique
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, May 08, 2003 - 08:58 pm: |
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Hey Troy,
Apparently this discussion will remain forever suspended in the limbo of what's porn and what's erotica. I guess "one man's meat is another man's poison..."
BTW, I was really looking forward to the special on Race, but the PBS outlet in Chicago never aired it. I will check out the web site you posted. |
Chris Hayden
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, May 10, 2003 - 10:17 am: |
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Troy:
I get it now--your problem was with the title. Maybe I am desensitized but it didn't even phase me.
Do you remember when "funk" used to be a bad word? |
Troy
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, May 11, 2003 - 12:46 am: |
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Chris, yes! I'm talking about the title (again I said I never read the book). Since the title did not phase you I would be willing to bet you are at least 10 years younger than I am.
As far as funk is concerned...
"Loan me your funky mind and I shall play with it. For nothing is good unless you play with it. And all that is good, is nasty!"
--Funkadelic
"Funk" was never a bad word in my dictionary (smile).
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Tee C. Royal
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, May 11, 2003 - 04:16 pm: |
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Here's the link to her short story I mentioned:
http://www.eroticanoir.com/cycle.html
And Troy, I follow you on the title and as I said, I thought she was joking when she first told me. I still question the industry on this one...perhaps this is why the cover doesn't show the entire title (to my recollection).
-Tee |
Chris Hayden
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, May 12, 2003 - 11:45 am: |
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Troy:
I am fifty three.
Why didn't the title phase me? It may be because I have been listening to too much gangsta rap (this weekend I pigged out on Tupac Shakur, Biggie Smalls and the ghetto boys--got me ready to tote a nine and tell people to back the f** up before they get smacked the f** up--
More likely it is because of what has been going on in the world since the year 2000--but that's for another board.
Hey man! You live in New York! You folks 'sposed to be blase about porn. Times Square and all that. Another urban myth, shot to hell.
And that line was from the first Funkadelic Album, wasn't it? Was it from
"Mommy, What's a Funkadelic?" or "What is Soul?" I forget. I was funkin' when it first came out, and yes, before the 50's funk was a bad word because it was a euphemism for another four letter f word--guess what. That changed in the 60's--I remember "Funky Broadway" by Dyke and the Blazers was the first one that broke the funk line and it caused quite a stir.
And "Funk Used to be a bad word" is from "Let's Take it To the Stage" from the album of the same name by Funkadelic--Oh yes, I knows mah funk!
("Now everybody's tryin' to get down!) |
Cynique
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Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, May 12, 2003 - 06:01 pm: |
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Maybe it's a regional thing, but I go way back with the word "funk" and in these parts it was never considered anything but a synonym for "body odor." Musicians eventually co-opted the term, adopting it as a way to describe songs that were earthy and soulful. |
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