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Thumper
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, February 14, 2003 - 10:09 pm: | 
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Hello All,
I just thought I would ask, for real now, ain't nobody here but us, do y'all really find the AA middle class interesting? Now, before you jump all PC on me, I ain't sayin' that there shouldn't be a middle class. I'm middle class. If I was hooked up with somebody that made the same amount of money per year that I do, we'd be sittin' at the bottom of that fabled 1% of upper middle class. I've had my moments when I didn't have no money (I mean having $20 in my pocket) and times when I didn't. I like the $20 more.
But, is the AA middle class that interesting in books? You all know that I done had my fill of the three-, four- sistergirl, U go girl books. With the search for Mr. Right, settling for Mr. Right now, dealing with Mr. Somebody done me wrong song, and Mr. Misunderstood at the beginning of the book, but by the end of the book he ain't misunderstood, he's a true dog that slip out of his flea collar and his wedding ring.
In an effort to flip that script, we now have middle class AA women who's dealing with the same 5 men that LaQuoan and her girls were foolin' with. The only thing that seem to have change between the sistergirl and the Ms. executive is the zip code.
What got me started on this is that I was thinking over Christopher Chambers new book, A Prayer For Deliverance. I love the book. I love Angela Bivens. But, Angela hang around Ms AA middle class women, and I find them so BORING! Do I really have to know about the designer clothes? "eyebrow raised* Is it really impressive that these women can afford to buy these designer clothers. I can buy a damn Big Mac anytime I want too, so what? It ain't like I'm going to see a picture of the dress or suit in the novel. If anything, this whole designer clothes thing endorses bulemia, anorexia, and all kinds of eating disorder. Peep this, first of all, whatever size that dress is, the woman has to stay that same size in order to wear it over and over again. And Chanel and Donna Karan don't have Lane Bryant lines. (Of course the most disturbing thing about the past sentence is that I KNOW THIS STUFF!! HOW DO I KNOW IT, FROM READING ALL THOSE AA MIDDLE CLASS WOMEN BOOKS!!!) Anyway, I digress, so that means that when the AA middle class woman start to get that "spread" going, no more Chanel and stuff, unless the woman don't eat, throw up nightly, and all that other stuff. Just to fit into some clothes with somebody else's name on it? It ain't that deep. And speaking for myself, I love to see a woman walk that has some swing, and something there to swing.
And although I do giggle at the 5 feet high Cindy Lou Who do's I see on the street (I'm waiting to see the small, battery operated, water fountain sitting in somebody's weave. And if any of you is around me, get back, cause I know I'm going to fall on the ground and laugh until I pee on myself. And before I forget that I would have the same reaction when I see one with a birdcage and a live yellow canary in it -- which of course will have the color co-ordinated weave.) Don't get upset with me. *LOL*
My point being, it's lively, interesting. Although, the styles don't do anything for me, I do admire the parade as it goes by. I don't get this with the charcters that has "arrived". So, although, I keep hearing the, "they think that we are all like THAT", is the PC version any better? |
Chris Hayden
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, February 15, 2003 - 10:48 am: |
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The A.A. middle class is not that interesting in the books that I have read because a gret effort is made to concentrate on the trappings and jobs and clothes and activities that make them middle class and not enough in the ones that make them human.
From reading a lot of these books you'd believe that because they are middle class, none of them have to deal with mental illness or race prejudice or death or personality failures or anything--it'sort of the World of Leave it to Beaver in Black--which I suppose leads us around to the reason these books are written, for escape.
JUNGLE FEVER by Spike Lee was a good look at how middle class people have problems, imposed by society, family and self. So, I guess, was MO BETTER BLUES.
INVISIBLE MAN, though it took place in another era, looked at the problems faced by a character who was trying to be middle class-- ie obtain a degree, move on up, etc.
I think the reason why books about the lower class have been more interesting is that one cannot escape or pretend that they are living some fantasy, that their struggles tend to be more visceral and life and death. |
Cynique
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, February 15, 2003 - 12:51 pm: |
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Could the way the AA middle class is portrayed in books be a case of "art imitating life?" The black bourgeosie is frequently ridiculed and dismissed by sociologists because of its preoccupation with the materialistic trappings that represent status symbols among its peer group. On a personal level, whether I encounter them in fact or fiction, there is nothing more boring to me than shallow, intellectual light-weights who seek to impress others with their superficial possessions. Some of the most compelling men I've ever met were the ones engaging me in conversation while I sat on a bar stool in a smoky, crowded, noisy hole-in-the wall, and let them buy me drinks. |
yukio
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, February 15, 2003 - 07:35 pm: |
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Thumper and all,
Good question(s)! I can't say that i've read many of the recent AA Middle class novels. In general, i think this discussion lends it self to the debate on "literary" vs. "commercial" fiction, in the sense that "literary" ficiton can often render an interesting middle class character and story; although a good storyteller like DIckey, in my opinion, can do the same in "commercial" fiction. I think "literary" is obviously more artistic and often more profound, experimental, etc... Commercial fiction tends to be soap opera-like page turners or plot driven rather than theme, language, style driven prose. What holds both genres together and what makes them possibly successful are the expectations of the reader and the basic storytelling of the writer. Consider some of my examples:Everett's character in Erasure is interesting; the characers in Song of Solomon; and the characters in A Visitation of Spirits. All "literary" fiction. Eric J. Dickey, however, is considered "commercial," and many of his characters have been middle class, yet he is a good storyteller and his, style, the heated sex scences, the music in the background, the cultural symbols, etc... are all great to me. Dickey puts you there...in the club, the apartment, in the cab...
I guess it is finally about the skill of the writer, regardless of genre. figure me for talking in circles...just some thoughts before i go to a restaurant... BTW, althouth i prefer "literary" fiction, i don't believe that being "literary" makes you a good storyteller..maybe creative, even "intellectual," but not necessarily a good story teller. |
Thumper
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, February 16, 2003 - 04:21 pm: |
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Hello All,
Chris: Yes, I see your point. Maybe my argument should be how they are portrayed. None of the books that I've read so far has addressed the question of AA who go through so much to assimilate into white society and maintain, or discard their "blackness". No before somebody ask me that same ol TIRED question that they believe is a trick question, but ain't, "Define Black? What do you mean about being black?" Look, save it. If you got to ask that question, then you can't possibly comprehend my answer. If these books would just explore something, anything else besides the men and the clothes, I could at least become interested in it. Last year Stephen Carter gave a good attempt with The Emperor of Ocean Park. And I still think the book is 400 pages too big. But at least it was something different.
About two weeks ago, one of the TV news magazines did a piece about black folks being prejudice against because of their names. A white employer would see an application with a name like LaQuoan, or TaKeisha and would toss the application into the trash. I know it happens more than not. How do I rectify this nugget of reality, or the fact that the glass ceiling is still around with one of the many books that has D'Ansheia working as the VP of anything? I guess I just want all fairy tales to start with the proper fairy tale introduction, "once upon a time there was a princess..."
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Glenda
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, February 16, 2003 - 10:44 pm: |
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I must agree that the portrayal of middle class AA characters in most novels makes for a very boring read. A classic example was E.Lynn Harris's last book, "A love of my own". I have been a fan of E.Lynn Harris since his very first book, but that last one left me wanting to just plain hurt somebody. There was so much name dropping with the designer clothes, the Crystal champagne, and the Palm Pilot, that somewhere along the line Mr. Harris forgot about a good story line and deep character development. With all the Bling, Bling going on I thought I was reading something written for the MTV generation. I find that if the success just happens to be written into the story line in a matter of fact manner, then the middle class AA character is much more interesting and acceptable. The Queen of Harlem and PG County are both two good examples of such writing. P.S. I too read The Emperor of Ocean Park and also found it way too long and at times boring. |
yukio
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, February 17, 2003 - 10:47 am: |
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I started The Emperor of Ocean Park too. BAB...need i say more? Ok, i'm sorry but...what happened in the end? I agree with everyone...its the storyteller's job to write a human character and a solid narrative as Chris and Glenda have suggested. I also agree with Cynique...art imitating life. This could also be a generational thing. Older folk, and i'm tryin not to be romantic about the past, were less pretensious about their success and more likely instructive of how they got what they got and how you could get it... It could also be the new middle-class and generation x which is more interested in the bling, bling bit....I'm too ol' and too po to be bling, blinging...Also, we should also differentiate the old middle class (ie. Em. of Ocean Park and the male character in Good Hair) from the younger middle class where these 30 somethings are the first generation to have a college and professional degree. In addition, we could also consider market for black books. I'm not sure, but of most of my friends, i'm one of the few who enjoys "literary" fiction. Most of my friends know all the new "commercial" literature, Zane, etc...all of them are college educated, mostly new middle class folk, and many of them see themselves in the literature. YOung single and successful black women searching for love...Again, i would call this fiction soap operas |
yolanda young
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, February 17, 2003 - 11:04 am: |
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Thumper,
Just the other night I was talking with DC's Karibu Books owner, Bro. Simba and he was asserting this very thing. To quote him, Bro. Simba suggested that blacks have "Lost their edge." I agree with his suggestion that even as affirmative action in college admissions is being threatened, the HIV virus is spreading faster in our community and a disproportionate number of black troops may die in a war we neither understand nor support; the black middle class has become too fat and rich to act. We'd rather discuss benign issues like fashion and the quest for some booty. |
Sandra
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, February 17, 2003 - 01:32 pm: |
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What is BAB? |
Tee C. Royal
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, February 17, 2003 - 02:05 pm: |
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Hey Sandra, that's a Tee Acronymn...LOL, it stands for Big Azz Books. You know? Like Emperor of Ocean Park.
-Tee |
yukio
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, February 17, 2003 - 08:05 pm: |
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hey, i asked if i could use "BAB" and you said yes...lol! I'm tryin to abuse...give us more acronyms! |
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