| Author | Message | ||
     Ntfs_encryption "Cyniquian" Level Poster Username: Ntfs_encryption Post Number: 1173 Registered: 10-2005 Rating: N/A |
The hate factory : N-word outburst adds to the denigration that passes as entertainment By Stanley Crouch When "Seinfeld" comedian Michael Richards lost his cool and began a racist rant at some noisy customers in a Hollywood comedy club, it seemed to surprise a number of people. It shouldn't. What is actually surprising is that it has taken this long for some airhead made famous by a very popular but insipid television series to flip out within the context of today's minstrel entertainments. Naturally, a lawyer representing the affronted audience members did not feel that it was enough for Richards to apologize on television; he still needs to pay them some money for what they had to suffer at his hands. The question, however, is what exactly did the patrons suffer? What they actually suffered, if anything, was an unintended caricature of a redneck in heated rage, expressing conventional disdain for black people. Richards said that 50 years ago, the black members of the noisy group of comedy club customers would have been hanged, and stabbed in the backside with a pitchfork. Before leaving the stage, Richards reminded the assembled that when it was all over, he would still be wealthy and the black people would still be, well, N-words. The painfully unfunny comedian Paul Rodriguez performed on the same stage that evening and told the press that if one uses the N-word and is not African-American, a lot of explaining will have to be made. In the interest of equality, no black comedian should get a pass when using insulting and denigrating words in the middle of an act. It all seems very simple to me. We do not need to accept the conventions of insult and denigration that have been established by black comedians and rappers. And I do not feel that there should be a freedom of speech issue raised either. Nor do I feel that any laws need to be passed. This was another moment to question what the ongoing vulgarization of our popular culture has actually come to mean. Two groups - women and black people - are disdainfully addressed and demeaned constantly. Only one has made any protest against being the constant butt of overstated vulgarity. White women have stood up against the misogyny in popular entertainment, but black people have not had much to say about the denigration. Rap producers and others in the business of selling anything that gives a little spice to the minstrel content of our popular culture have been known to claim that the N-word has become a common means of expression and has taken on a universal understanding through rap. We can now be treated to young people of all ethnic groups referring to each other when using the word. Does that prove anything? I think not. When Richard Pryor first made liberal use of the N-word, he could not have imagined what emerged in the wake of his performances. But when Pryor himself took a position against minstrel updates, no one listened to him. He had passed out the right of irresponsibility and could not take it back. So what remains before us is the issue of coming to terms with a popular culture in which the N-word, bitches and hos have become no more than condiments in a particularly unappetizing meal. We need not ban their use, but we do need to face the fact that we have been hustled far more often than not. | ||
| Cynique "Cyniquian" Level Poster Username: Cynique Post Number: 5861 Registered: 01-2004 Rating: N/A |
Stanley is on point and no amount of sputtering and obfuscation on the part of haters can deny the truth. BTW, Paul Mooney who is a particuarly abrasive sexist stand-up comic has said that he will no longer use the word "nigger" in his act. | ||
| Yukio Veteran Poster Username: Yukio Post Number: 1472 Registered: 01-2004 Rating: N/A |
so beyond calling Seinfeld insipid and P. Rodriguez unfunny, what has Crouch contributed to this conversation? all he is saying is, using the n-word is bad. | ||
| Cynique "Cyniquian" Level Poster Username: Cynique Post Number: 5862 Registered: 01-2004 Rating: N/A |
There is no need to embellish the truth. Stanley is adding his voice to the controversy. He's entitled. | ||
| Yukio Veteran Poster Username: Yukio Post Number: 1473 Registered: 01-2004 Rating: N/A |
i'm sorry? What exactly is he adding? | ||
| Cynique "Cyniquian" Level Poster Username: Cynique Post Number: 5868 Registered: 01-2004 Rating: N/A |
His "voice". "Voice" as in part of the chorus who deplore liberties taken with the word "nigger". Is there anything new that can be added to this ongoing debate? Certainly what Marvin X said wasn't original. | ||
| Ntfs_encryption "Cyniquian" Level Poster Username: Ntfs_encryption Post Number: 1178 Registered: 10-2005 Rating: N/A |
"i'm sorry? What exactly is he adding?" His commentary. Did you not read it? What is he supposed to have added? He's a columnist and he wrote an article about the pathetic and inexcusable usage of the "N" word. That's what he "added"! He did what he is paid to do. What are you expecting him to "add"? Details please.... | ||
| Yukio Veteran Poster Username: Yukio Post Number: 1476 Registered: 01-2004 Rating: N/A |
cynique: you are right. Marvin X's comments certainly were not "original," but his article does have some analysis...though it too is limited. Croach's writing style is provocative, but thats all it is...style but no substance. | ||
| Ntfs_encryption "Cyniquian" Level Poster Username: Ntfs_encryption Post Number: 1181 Registered: 10-2005 Rating: N/A |
"Crouch’s writing style is provocative, but thats all it is...style but no substance." Uh huh....yep. You're right. When Crouch said: "This was another moment to question what the ongoing vulgarization of our popular culture has actually come to mean. Two groups - women and black people - are disdainfully addressed and demeaned constantly. Only one has made any protest against being the constant butt of overstated vulgarity. White women have stood up against the misogyny in popular entertainment, but black people have not had much to say about the denigration." It was of no substance. Meant nothing and nothing of significance could be extrapolated from that paragraph. Nothing about it was true nor relevant to anything in the real world. There was no message or point he made that could possibly be taken seriously. You're right....... | ||
| Abm "Cyniquian" Level Poster Username: Abm Post Number: 6842 Registered: 04-2004 Rating: |
A society and people that can be wholly defined by comedians and rappers has much BIGGER problems than that which stem from the utterance of nigger. | ||
| Renata Veteran Poster Username: Renata Post Number: 1575 Registered: 08-2005 Rating: N/A |
ABM, that's the smartest thing said here so far. | ||
| Latina_wi Regular Poster Username: Latina_wi Post Number: 63 Registered: 08-2006 Rating: N/A |
ABM said: A society and people that can be wholly defined by comedians and rappers has much BIGGER problems than that which stem from the utterance of nigger. LATINA replies: A very good point made abm. The words of those who form or shape the countries we live in are far more important than what those who bring 'light enetrtainment' say. I have seen less fuss being made about sexual abuse by those in US congress or racist comments made by the conservative party (the opposition party for the UK's current government). However, I am very happy that the debate about the use of the n-word is being brought up. That word is steeped in such a disgusting history that even the use of it to 'empower' blacks is a stupid argument. It empowers no one and just reminds african-americans of how people used to view them. Black history doesn't just stop at slavery or the harsh treatment blacks one received. It is so much more. I am so happy to see that african-americans are making a backlash againts this word. No racial slur (or even 'ex-racial slur') should be viewed as empowering or accepted in that mainstream. On the big brother show in the uk one white english girl actually said that it was okay to call blacks the n word as it is a 'nickname' for them!!!! This is very strange to me as the n word is far less accepted in europe and blacks in the uk usually hail from the caribbean where the n word was far less used. And black africans in europe have great great disdain for the n word too. Just goes to show how powerful the american media can be that the n word is even deemed as becoming 'acceptable' when those country with no real history of the n word start to use it! Madness! | ||
| Ntfs_encryption "Cyniquian" Level Poster Username: Ntfs_encryption Post Number: 1183 Registered: 10-2005 Rating: |
"A society and people that can be wholly defined by comedians and rappers has much BIGGER problems than that which stem from the utterance of nigger." Unfortunately, you are right. But the imagery and emulation of rappers and athletes, coupled with the self degrading arrogance and ignorance of using the “N” word, has had a devastating affect on a generation of blacks. Sad but true. | ||
| Yvettep Veteran Poster Username: Yvettep Post Number: 1434 Registered: 01-2005 Rating: N/A |
I'll tell you about a word with power: A comic uses his platform to invoke the image of lynching Black men but what gets talked more about is his use of that word. That's power. http://www.withoutsanctuary.org/main.html | ||
| Cynique "Cyniquian" Level Poster Username: Cynique Post Number: 5872 Registered: 01-2004 Rating: |
"A society and people that can be wholly defined by comedians and rappers has much BIGGER problems than that which stem from the utterance of nigger." Boy, are we playing fast and loose with the word "wholly". The main gripe against rappers and comedians is that they give the outside world a partial view of the greater black community, concentrating on its baser aspects. And just how do you separate utterance of the word "nigger" from the "bigger problem" since they are one in the same, considering the word nigger and its implications are at the core of the material of the performers who are "defining a society and people." | ||
| Abm "Cyniquian" Level Poster Username: Abm Post Number: 6843 Registered: 04-2004 Rating: N/A |
Latina_wi, I'll be much happier when Black people become potent enuff for nigger to not matter. I can call White foks cracker, honky, palefaced, flata$$, teeny dyck peckerwoods from now 'til until the Great Hereafter. They still own, run and/or control everydayamthing. Ntfs, Here is what I find ironic: Black foks rose, succeeded and evolved much MORE effectively while White foks could EASILY and REGULARLY called them nigger (coon, boy, spade, darkie, etc.) than they do NOW, when Whites are much LESS apt so utter the word. Explain THAT irony to me, Kemosabee. | ||
| Cynique "Cyniquian" Level Poster Username: Cynique Post Number: 5881 Registered: 01-2004 Rating: N/A |
Puleeze. Excuse Pocahantas, while she snickers. It took black folks 400+ years to "rise succeed and evolve" while being called the word "nigger". Over the past 50 years, slave descendants became more affluent and accomplished during the time whites were "much less apt to utter the word". | ||
| Latina_wi Regular Poster Username: Latina_wi Post Number: 64 Registered: 08-2006 Rating: N/A |
ABM said: Here is what I find ironic: Black foks rose, succeeded and evolved much MORE effectively while White foks could EASILY and REGULARLY called them nigger (coon, boy, spade, darkie, etc.) than they do NOW, when Whites are much LESS apt so utter the word. Latina_WI replies: Good point. And I believe that the rise in affluence of the african-american 50 years ago was a far greater feat than it has been today because the african-american had so much less back then. They also had a far greater struggle face due to racism been not only around more at the time, but expected and accepted. To me, the achievement of a black person sitting on the front of the bus means a lot more than some monosyballic rapper (you know who you are 50 cent!) earning a few million dollars with a repititive rap songs and AWFUL merchandising. | ||
| Cynique "Cyniquian" Level Poster Username: Cynique Post Number: 5883 Registered: 01-2004 Rating: N/A |
Whites probably "utter" the word nigger as much now as they ever did, they just don't do it in public because it's politically incorrect. Making a connection between black progress and the decline in the public utterence of the word "nigger" by whites is really an artificial premise. The progress was made by whites who found more subtle ways of expressing racism. The debate going on now is really about some blacks not wanting other blacks to co-opt the weapon of their oppressor. | ||
| Latina_wi Regular Poster Username: Latina_wi Post Number: 67 Registered: 08-2006 Rating: N/A |
^^^Hmmm...I think racism is far less accepted now as it was back 'then' as people now realise racism is wrong. I have never recieved any shocking racial prejudice that I could remember by a white person, or any person. Just some ignorance sometimes (but everyone has been the victim of that I suppose). As for blacks calling eachother nigger? My view on that is it is a complete and utter no-no. We are past those times now. When rappers used it previously, mainly in concious hip-hop, there was actually a point. | ||
| Cynique "Cyniquian" Level Poster Username: Cynique Post Number: 5885 Registered: 01-2004 Rating: N/A |
Speak for yourself, Senorita. "Subtle" and "insidious" are the operative words when dealing with racism in America. | ||
| Yukio Veteran Poster Username: Yukio Post Number: 1477 Registered: 01-2004 Rating: N/A |
Ntfs_encryption: If you think that paragraph was substance then thats your right. Substance is analysis to me...his comments are more...discriptive and intellectually ol' hat. In fact, his comments are exactly what I am against, which is focus on this rhetoric, but then talk shit about rappers but not talk about the sublty and insidiousness of racism... | ||
| Abm "Cyniquian" Level Poster Username: Abm Post Number: 6849 Registered: 04-2004 Rating: N/A |
This obession with the citation of nigger allows many of us to skirt the the fact that our families and communities are coming apart at the seams and NONE of us have any EFFECTIVE means to thwart our demise. | ||
| Latina_wi Regular Poster Username: Latina_wi Post Number: 68 Registered: 08-2006 Rating: N/A |
CYNIQUE said: Speak for yourself, Senorita. "Subtle" and "insidious" are the operative words when dealing with racism in America. Latina_WI: Yes, I forget that america is so different race relation wise. It shocks me how different it is sometimes. Though the UK often has subtle and blatant racism it is strongly vilified and there are many moves to try and stamp it out. And abm is right, to help the progress of balcks in the US we need to look at the problem in a more direct manner. | ||
| Cynique "Cyniquian" Level Poster Username: Cynique Post Number: 5887 Registered: 01-2004 Rating: N/A |
Contrary to all of the patented rhetoric, the crises in the black family is concentrated in the underclass of the inner-cities. And any time upwardly mobile blacks try to offer constructive critcism to alleviate the problems, they are shouted down by those who accuse them of being unsympathetic, the same folks who are reluctant to "cite" ghettoites for becoming the self-fulfilled prophecies of those who rap about about "niggas". | ||
| Yukio Veteran Poster Username: Yukio Post Number: 1479 Registered: 01-2004 Rating: N/A |
cynique: I dont know about that...family, as I see it, is more than the nuclear unit. And the fact is, that oftentimes than not, the criticism is a) not constructive and b)the poorer person has a chip on their shoulder because they know they haven't been doing right; and finally c)the conversation once it is had is restricted to how the poorer person needs to change their life. That does very little, if we are going to talk about "The Black Family." In other words, you can't go home by home because it doesn't work. The capitalist system aint set up for that...shitd' it dont even work for white people and this matrix is of their making. As I am wont to say, the structural element, Cynique, needs to be addressed. And that is where the tension is, because if we, like foolish Oprah, promulgate this idea that it all about pulling up your bootstraps, a la Booker T. Washington, then we are throwing out the baby w/the bath water....in other words, there is this assumption that the struggle is over...and that there is no need for organization, we just need to be hard workers and embrace mainstream culture...this si the rhethoric laid out in the underclass literature...but: the many working poor, assidious and all, dramatically show that it aint jus a question of work ethic. So folk need to organize! | ||
| Cynique "Cyniquian" Level Poster Username: Cynique Post Number: 5889 Registered: 01-2004 Rating: N/A |
Yes, the problem needs to be redefined, and goals made more specific and realistic. I've always felt that each family has to become its own project, because nothing works for everybody. As for folk organizing, lotsa luck. | ||
| Ntfs_encryption "Cyniquian" Level Poster Username: Ntfs_encryption Post Number: 1192 Registered: 10-2005 Rating: N/A |
”Ntfs_encryption: If you think that paragraph was substance then thats your right. Substance is analysis to me...his comments are more...discriptive and intellectually ol' hat.” So? It doesn’t matter because what he said was true. No? Then please show me exactly were he lied, exaggerated or distorted the truth. Details please…. ”In fact, his comments are exactly what I am against, which is focus on this rhetoric, but then talk shit about rappers but not talk about the sublty and insidiousness of racism...” Really? You’re against his commentary? I see….So what exactly did you object to? When he said, “Two groups - women and black people - are disdainfully addressed and demeaned constantly”? Were you offended when he said, “White women have stood up against the misogyny in popular entertainment, but black people have not had much to say about the denigration”? Or were you intellectually offended when he wrote, ”So what remains before us is the issue of coming to terms with a popular culture in which the N-word, bitches and hos have become no more than condiments in a particularly unappetizing meal”? And his assessment of rappers was on the money. Again, what exactly what did he write that offended you? And exactly where are the intellectually ol’ hat ideas manifested? |
