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Robynmarie
Regular Poster
Username: Robynmarie
Post Number: 180
Registered: 04-2006
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, November 20, 2006 - 10:30 pm: | 
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Dude from Seinfeld went straight off.
www.tmz.com |
Toubobie
First Time Poster
Username: Toubobie
Post Number: 4
Registered: 08-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, November 20, 2006 - 11:03 pm: |
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Does anyone have a post of the infamous rantings of a Def Comedy Jam regular like Mr. Mike "Day-Day" Epps? Let's watch and compare his performance with Kramer's performance. Does Epps say "n*ggah" with love in his heart? I'm curious to know what black people think about this double-standard. The word is wretched and sick and no one, black or white, should use it. |
Robynmarie
Regular Poster
Username: Robynmarie
Post Number: 182
Registered: 04-2006
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, November 20, 2006 - 11:26 pm: |
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Kramer was in complete, attack meltdown mode, sprewing not just racist rants but he said the hecklers should be lynched. How does that compare to Def Comedy Jam?
Kramer knows what he said was racist and vicious. That's why he is on Lettermen apologizing. If he was truly innocent, he would have said what you said, "hey they use the word on Def Comedy Jam all the time. What's the big deal?" |
Toubobie
First Time Poster
Username: Toubobie
Post Number: 7
Registered: 08-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, November 21, 2006 - 12:37 am: |
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By their obvious lack of self-respect, most Def Jam comedians hate black people (themselves) just as much as any racist. |
Robynmarie
Regular Poster
Username: Robynmarie
Post Number: 183
Registered: 04-2006
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, November 21, 2006 - 09:41 am: |
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I don't agree that Def Jam folks hate themselves.
DJ comedians do use the n-word in their comedy routines, as did Richard Pryor and other black comics.
And why is it when white people do/say something foul and disgusting, it's black people's fault/responsibility?
Richards wasn't joking or tryin to be funny. He was pissed off because a couple of black guys who paid to see his sorry ass, told him the truth-he wasn't funny. His true colors came out. And no he isn't sorry. The only reason he apologized is because he got caught on tape. |
Toubobie
Newbie Poster
Username: Toubobie
Post Number: 11
Registered: 08-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, November 21, 2006 - 12:28 pm: |
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Robynmarie, you've made lots of assumptions in that post. I don't argue assumptions.
Allow me, however, to correct you on a fact: Richard Pryor vowed to never use the "N" word in his later years of stand up after his voyage to Africa. Check out his performance "Live from Sunset Strip" It is indeed enlightening, and will help you see where I'm coming from with respect to the majority of Def Jam "comics."
Pryor realized that what he'd been spewing regarding the denigration of black people (before his African voyage of self awareness and self love) was incredibly wrong.
The "N" word out of anyone's mouth is incredibly wrong, be it from Def Jam comics, Michael Richards, or anyone else. |
Chrishayden
AALBC .com Platinum Poster
Username: Chrishayden
Post Number: 2994
Registered: 03-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, November 21, 2006 - 01:09 pm: |
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Touboubie:
I don't give a damn if Mike Epps called his mama a nigger. White folks can't say it. They want to get in a snit because there is something they can't call us--
"You all say it, they whine"
Well, here are a few things white people call each other that people outside their group--Yid, Pecker, Dago, Fag, Dyke, Chink etc etc etc.
This ain't 50 years ago, no matter what you and Cosmo Kramer think. Now line up to go buy his DVD like you do to get the ADC. |
Cynique
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Cynique
Post Number: 5807
Registered: 01-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, November 21, 2006 - 03:03 pm: |
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Michael Richards lost control and spoke his true thoughts, because it is true that during the 50s "nigger" hecklers might've been strung up and had a "fork stuck up their asses". Still, in civilized society all people should refrain from making a public spectacle of their racial prejudices. His apology had a hollow ring to it. |
Chrishayden
AALBC .com Platinum Poster
Username: Chrishayden
Post Number: 3004
Registered: 03-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, November 21, 2006 - 03:12 pm: |
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I must admit I thought it was the funniest thing I ever seen him do--but I love people doing a Howard Beal type meltdown in public.
I also assign some fault to the 2 Negroes that were heckling him--they went to see Cosmo Kramer and they are surpriseed to find out he wasn't funny? No wonder white folks think we crazy!
As I understand it, heckling is part of standup comedy and if you can't handle the hecklers you should stay out of the kitchen. Cosmo been in front of the camera so long (or appeared in front of mindless, fawning audiences) so that he is out of shape. He can't handle standup.
But he's getting more publicity than he has in years. He has really done something. If I was his agent I'd have him make this part of his act--hire a couple of coloureds to sit in the audience and heckle him and he can meltdown.
America has quit pretending-- |
Robynmarie
Regular Poster
Username: Robynmarie
Post Number: 184
Registered: 04-2006
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, November 21, 2006 - 03:17 pm: |
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I'd never heard about the "fork up your butt" torture for black people. Pfff
Richards is a seething, vicious racist. He was at a comedy club for Chrissakes. Heckling is part of the dealio.
And worse still, it's hard to believe his buddy Seinfeld did not know about his friend's hair trigger temper. The slurs flowed so readily from his tongue. Like he had lots of practice. |
Yukio
Veteran Poster
Username: Yukio
Post Number: 1440
Registered: 01-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, November 21, 2006 - 07:45 pm: |
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This is difficult, because it is about context, memory, and cultural meaning. All of these variables dictate ultimately the meaning of the word in the final analysis. There is also this problem w/soaclled fairness and parity. What is often not discussed is that white people like to determine the nature of the discussion. So that they say "well, if black people say it, why can't I say it? I mean it as a term of endearment too!"
And then this then ends the conversation b/c many black folks feel uncomfortable saying what white folk cant do...fortunately, Mr. Hayden is not one of them! |
Toubobie
Newbie Poster
Username: Toubobie
Post Number: 12
Registered: 08-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, November 21, 2006 - 08:10 pm: |
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chrishayden,
it's sad to know that you would not mind if mike epps called his own mother a "n*gga." would you have a problem if he called your mother a "n*gga?"
no one should use that loaded slur, period. |
Yukio
Veteran Poster
Username: Yukio
Post Number: 1442
Registered: 01-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, November 21, 2006 - 08:24 pm: |
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toubobie:
but aren't you assuming that the word has one meaning, one cultural referent...the one refering to slavery and jim crow? doesn't your logic equate the power of whites with the power of blacks?
Is this not a slight of hand, as well as convenience, of reasoning to:
a) blame blacks for 'self-hate'?
b) repress the actual history of racism--the lynching, rape, free labor, unequal pay, etc--and instead use a word as campaign against racism?
c) shift blame from whites to blacks by equating the usage of the word by blacks and whites? |
Yukio
Veteran Poster
Username: Yukio
Post Number: 1443
Registered: 01-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, November 21, 2006 - 09:23 pm: |
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hmmmm....here is an email, I sent out to a few friends concerning the N word:
Happy Turkey Day!
Most recently, we have seen Michael Richards, aka Kramer from Seinfeld, rant racial epithets at some black people heckling him in a comedy club. He used the N word countless times. His usage of the word has prompted him to apologize, as well as brought about discussion of the usage of the N word. There are two camps, so to speak. The “word is racist and evil and no one should use it” camp; and, the faction to which I belong, the “terms of endearment” camp. But, my comments, however, have less to do with its usage and more with using the word as a campaign to combat racism.
Let me say that both camps are valid. Yet, there is a tendency to get so caught up on the usage of this word, this is especially the case among white people, that the mere use of the word gets more attention than what it has historically referred to. This slight of hand results in:
a) blaming black folk for 'self-hate'
b) repressing the actual history of racism--the lynching, rape, free labor, unequal pay, etc…
c) shifting the discussion of racism to 1)what to call a person who uses the word or 2) a debate on the legitimacy or illegitimacy of using the word. This shifts the discussion from a critique of a racist system to racist words, as well as equates the usage of the N word by blacks to that of whites.
Thus, once people get caught up on the word, it not only becomes a heated conversation but also a proxy or substitute for the real exploitation and murder that black people endured, and still endure.
In fact, as you listen to Richards, the audience doesn’t seem bothered when he says:
:http://us.video.aol.com/video.index.adp?mode=1&pmmsid=1772645
"50 yrs ago we'd have you upside down with a fucking fork up your ass!
But once he said nigga a few times folk got irate and some walked out. This is dangerous, because this word, a racial slur, can almost stand for the whole long history of slavery, colonialism, and Jim and Jane Crow! I’m not saying folk need to allow others to misuse the word, but that those of us who are concerned about black people in particular, and people of color in general, not lose sight of the battle! If the N word becomes a proxy, then there will be little discussion of the more substantive issues, such as reparations, institutional racism, and the like....it will just be become a debate or uncomfortable situation that allows people to use the word and then assuage black folk and others by doing community service and saying sorry!
Walk Well,
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Toubobie
Newbie Poster
Username: Toubobie
Post Number: 13
Registered: 08-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, November 21, 2006 - 10:12 pm: |
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yukio,
like i mentioned before, i don't dabble in assumptions
the double-standard is, in fact, the problem
i'll entertain you, however:
what should we do with those mixed people who could pass as white with a drop of negroid blood. should they be allowed to us this word? does that ounce of negroid blood give them license to use that filthy word? what about a "white" face who has a black relative twice removed? what is the genetic threshhold here? if we are not prepared to have this futile discussion, in the name of decency, no one should use the word.
certainly it is a foolish concept to grant certain individuals the right to use it, and others not.
no one should use it, black, white, or anywhere in between.
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Yukio
Veteran Poster
Username: Yukio
Post Number: 1444
Registered: 01-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, November 21, 2006 - 10:26 pm: |
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toubobie:
if you were entertaining me, then, you would be addressing my post, which has nothing to do with, "grant[ing] certain individuals the right to use it, and others not."
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Toubobie
Newbie Poster
Username: Toubobie
Post Number: 15
Registered: 08-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, November 21, 2006 - 10:30 pm: |
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yukio,
your post addressed my post in the same capacity, void of relevance all the same |
Renata
Veteran Poster
Username: Renata
Post Number: 1537
Registered: 08-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, November 21, 2006 - 10:37 pm: |
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Well, I can say that even when black people say it to me, they mean it as a slur. And when I say it to a person, I mean it in a derogatory way as well....when I use it, I'm usually in a heated argument or just really angry about something. It's not something I'd call a friend. |
Yukio
Veteran Poster
Username: Yukio
Post Number: 1446
Registered: 01-2004
Rating: 
Votes: 1 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, November 21, 2006 - 11:16 pm: |
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toubobie:
actually, i did address your post. . . first, that it was one-sided and superfluous; then in my more general post, i highlighted both the legitimacy and the potential, if not imminent, danger of it.
Here is the long post abbreviated:
The danger, as i explained, is generally two-fold: a) it equates the usage of the word by blacks with the same by whites; this is ahistorical. The power that blacks wield is indeed insignificant beyond the interpersonal as compared with the power that whites wield as individuals and as a group; and of more import, b) that the hue and cry that the N word brings about could become a proxy for a legitimate assessment and critique of the history to which the N word refers, and the continuity of racism that folk like to claim doesn't exist.
While folk, both white and black, hate to hear the word, their engagement with racism, the past and the present, is often limited to racial slurs. In other words, they say, "i'll abide the PC handbook," claim that the country is colorblind or that blacks' characterization of this society as racist is a form of victimization.
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Nels
Veteran Poster
Username: Nels
Post Number: 574
Registered: 07-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, November 22, 2006 - 02:29 am: |
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As long as dumb fucks like Chris Rock, Cedric The Entertainer, Eddie Griffin and the like keep on referring to "blacks" (i.e., in particular dark skin blacks like themselves) as niggers in their comedy routines, then people like "Michael Richards" can and will keep on using the "N" word. The "N" word's a waste of time. Get on with life. |
Robynmarie
Regular Poster
Username: Robynmarie
Post Number: 185
Registered: 04-2006
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, November 22, 2006 - 07:36 am: |
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People like Michael Richards are using the n-word regardless of what African American comedians say and do.
Do you really think blacks have any influence over white folks? |
Zuriburi
Regular Poster
Username: Zuriburi
Post Number: 153
Registered: 11-2005
Rating: 
Votes: 1 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, November 22, 2006 - 08:33 am: |
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Yokio, allbeit true that concentrating on the use of the word nigger only bearly scratches the surface of institutional white supremacy, we cannot ignore the pathological implications when an essentially powerless group, (like black people) have internalised white supremacy to such an extent that we dillusionally claim to have "redifined" such a dehumanising, and derogatory term ment to aid in our destruction.
Personally I am less frightened and angered to hear this term come from the mouth of non-black people that I am to hear it out of a Black persons mouth. Because in my opinion it is one of the most definitive indicators of our compltete internalisation and NORMALISATION of Black DEFEAT.
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Zuriburi
Regular Poster
Username: Zuriburi
Post Number: 154
Registered: 11-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, November 22, 2006 - 08:41 am: |
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The only way that I would ever be at ease with its use is if and when we become an economically,socially,and culturally independent and self sustaining community and stop being and acting like niggers FOR REAL. Than we can call oursleves what the fuck we want. |
Abm
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Abm
Post Number: 6809
Registered: 04-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, November 22, 2006 - 09:21 am: |
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We too often exaggerate the potency of the recitation of "nigger" while largely ignoring or avoiding confronting the ACTIONS that make and keep us "nigger". |
Zuriburi
Regular Poster
Username: Zuriburi
Post Number: 155
Registered: 11-2005
Rating:
Votes: 1 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, November 22, 2006 - 09:48 am: |
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We use the word, because that is how we see ourselves. Our words are mirrors of US. There is no separation between the use of the word and our ACTION.
Erasing this word from our vocabulary or even using it as Kola does ie...as a definition of those who conciously and willfully work against the interest of blacks, would imply a healthy mental shift.
But, refusing to critique its use is akin to refusing to critique every other pathology born out of internalised white supremacy that can be found within the African diaspora. |
Chrishayden
AALBC .com Platinum Poster
Username: Chrishayden
Post Number: 3010
Registered: 03-2004
Rating:
Votes: 2 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, November 22, 2006 - 11:47 am: |
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Toubobie:
You must be white.
If you are, whatever you say means absolutely nothing to me.
You are not QUALIFIED to even weigh in on the discussion. Get that? Go on the NeoNazi sites and talk to them. |
Abm
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Abm
Post Number: 6815
Registered: 04-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, November 22, 2006 - 12:43 pm: |
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Chris,
"Your middle name must be 'Butter'. 'Cause [nikka] You are on a ROLL!!!"
HAHAHAHAHAHA!!! |
Yukio
Veteran Poster
Username: Yukio
Post Number: 1448
Registered: 01-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, November 22, 2006 - 12:57 pm: |
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zuriburi: the use of the n word connotes only what the person who used it and what the listeners who interpret the word to mean.
As I said, i am in the term of endearment camp.
But no disrespect, but these issues are really ancillary to my point!
We keep giving more power to the word, and we keep falling into the discussion, or what I will call a trap, that this post is ostensibly about: the use of a problematic word...a lowly word! And this mobilzes people---to have a Dream and evoke Martin of the past and perhaps claim, like the conservative R. Innis that we are backsliding cuz Kanye W said something foolish, etc....And once he, that is Kramer and his elk, says sorry, all is forgiven and an engagement with the here and now is dropped! That is the present nature of our, as a group, engagement w/these issues: a discussion of the N word, criticizing poor blacks, and blaming everything on hip hop!
Now, keep in mind, I know people here do more than talk about the word, for i have engaged some of you here for several years.
BUT, in general, the discussion we have here, at aalbc, seems not to be a part of the mainstream discourse[of course I'm not surprised]. And, in some of the books I have read recently, mostly history and political essays [after the storm, particuarly Adolph Reeds] about black folk, the discussion is often parochial.
Since this Kramer business has elicited such a hue and cry, it is interesting to see how people respond at the popular level so that we can get a sense of US mainstream beliefs.
What this recent situation says to me, at this point, is that people, white and black, will distance themselves from Richards, at least for a little while, and then proceed uncritically of the prison industrial complex. Shit, rather than say what he would do 50 yrs ago w/a fork, he could have said, well now we are throwing you and the spics in general w/the encouragement of bill cosby and juan williams and their elk!
Or, we, us white folk, are gonna use Barak Obama and get him into the white house, keep him safe, and after he does well as a president for this couuntry, we are gonna tell the world and you niggas that we are not racist because we voted in a black man as president and he wasn't assassinated! |
Cynique
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Cynique
Post Number: 5810
Registered: 01-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, November 22, 2006 - 01:02 pm: |
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In a way, "nigger" is like the word "fuck". It can be used in many contexts. These words are both very manipulative in their effect. But no word can compare to the power of the word nigger. This 6-letter, 2 syllable utterance is the ultimate weapon of the mind. To blacks "nigger" is about race, to whites "nigger" is about racism. Blacks are enslaved by their attachment to it, and whites are enslaved by their need for it. NIGGER It is a gut-wrenching word - it pushes the tongue against the roof of the mouth and makes the lips curl and the sound of it resonates with contempt. What a burden it is to society. |
Abm
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Abm
Post Number: 6817
Registered: 04-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, November 22, 2006 - 01:07 pm: |
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Wonder how foks might have felt about and responded if while being heckled by Jewish foks a Black comedian meanly joked about Jews being killed in Nazi gas chambers and having their naked dead bodies buried in mass graves. |
Chrishayden
AALBC .com Platinum Poster
Username: Chrishayden
Post Number: 3019
Registered: 03-2004
Rating:
Votes: 1 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, November 22, 2006 - 01:13 pm: |
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This word has no power over you that you don't want it to have. That it has power over you is a measure of your weakness.
Because this word upsets you look for white people to use it on you at every turn. I sure would.
Cynique, if you weren't trying so hard to be white, it wouldn't take your mind. |
Toubobie
Newbie Poster
Username: Toubobie
Post Number: 16
Registered: 08-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, November 22, 2006 - 01:15 pm: |
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yukio,
your post had nothing to do with my post. the questions i posed were nowhere found in your rant. instead you bombarded the message board with assumptions and continue to do so. the only thing one-sided is your wordy, excessive, and rather surface argument |
Robynmarie
Regular Poster
Username: Robynmarie
Post Number: 186
Registered: 04-2006
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, November 22, 2006 - 01:17 pm: |
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http://video.msn.com/v/us/msnbc.htm?g=7bf2eca6-ad20-4362-bb5b-b57a5848e8d9&f=00& fg=email
The targets of Michael Richard's attacks are speaking out (and 'bout to be paid; Gloria Allred is on the case).
For me, MR's rant was way beyond using the n-word. It sounded like he was calling a round up for a Klan killing. And why he bothered with the "apology" on Letterman is a mystery. How can you apologize for what you are? |
Doberman23
Veteran Poster
Username: Doberman23
Post Number: 599
Registered: 01-2006
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, November 22, 2006 - 01:19 pm: |
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i personally think that approximately 88% of white people call black people and other minorities some racial slur behind closed doors everytime that one (a minority) does something that they don't like, richards (kramer) isn't sorry that he said what he said he's sorry for not being behind closed doors. i personally don't except his appology and i am actually getting tired of 88% assholes who think that someone is supposed to forgive their punk asses.
and Toubobie i simply don't think mike epps or any other def jam comics (maybe chris rock) use the magical "n" word under the same passion of hate as richards used it. but in the end of it all words are what you make of them, i am not saying that black people should respond to it with glee, but at the same time you can't let one word make you react like a dog when it's owner says "sick em rex!"
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Toubobie
Newbie Poster
Username: Toubobie
Post Number: 17
Registered: 08-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, November 22, 2006 - 01:26 pm: |
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Chrishayden,
you must be an insecure black male fool with hidden agendas (ie gender domination) with respect to black females.
To soothe your crusty male ego, I am not a honkey, nor am I a neutral beige mixed up blue blood. I'm probably blacker than you.
The truth hurts doesn't it? you wouldn't mind if Mr. Epps called YO MAMA a NIGGER! Shame on you, black male fool. |
Cynique
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Cynique
Post Number: 5812
Registered: 01-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, November 22, 2006 - 01:29 pm: |
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Oh, take you fat head out of the sand, chrishayden. As usual you respond to something that wasn't said because that's only defense you have. Somebody like you who is constantly referring to his fellow blacks as negroes is really the one who wants to be white. Your nigger mind is so fucked up, crissy boy. Face it. If nigger wasn't a powerful word, the Michael Richards brouhaha wouldn't be in the headlines. |
Yukio
Veteran Poster
Username: Yukio
Post Number: 1449
Registered: 01-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, November 22, 2006 - 01:33 pm: |
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toubobie: let me entertain you. You are correct. I have not addressed your questions, but I have directly addressed your initial comments. You claimed to entertain me by asking me questions WITHOUT addressing what i already put on the table....
You wrote:
The "N" word out of anyone's mouth is incredibly wrong, be it from Def Jam comics, Michael Richards, or anyone else.
then again you wrote:
certainly it is a foolish concept to grant certain individuals the right to use it, and others not.
no one should use it, black, white, or anywhere in between.
Thus, toubobie, there are no assumptions on my part. You are pretty consistent. To your position that no one should use the word, I wrote:
a) it equates the usage of the word by blacks with the same by whites; this is ahistorical. The power that blacks wield is indeed insignificant beyond the interpersonal as compared with the power that whites wield as individuals and as a group; and of more import,
b) that the hue and cry that the N word brings about could become a proxy for a legitimate assessment and critique of the history to which the N word refers, and the continuity of racism that folk like to claim doesn't exist.
Each directly, and clearly, address your main points.
On your questions:
You questions are ancillary to my posts! They all assume, to use your main rhetorical tool, that my post is about:
"grant[ing] certain individuals the right to use it, and others not."
To recapitulate:
Thus, once people get caught up on the word, it not only becomes a heated conversation but also a proxy or substitute for the real exploitation and murder that black people endured, and still endure.
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Yukio
Veteran Poster
Username: Yukio
Post Number: 1450
Registered: 01-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, November 22, 2006 - 01:37 pm: |
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Beyond this website, I believe that the discussion of the N word, is a proxy for a real engagement with the state of race and racism in this country. |
Toubobie
Newbie Poster
Username: Toubobie
Post Number: 18
Registered: 08-2005
Rating:
Votes: 1 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, November 22, 2006 - 01:48 pm: |
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yukio,
if that is what you call addressing my position, then you are delusional... reread my posts, then come again. Perhaps you should have called someone else out. I merely posed the question... that is not the same as establishing a premise... you argued a question, this is what is making you dazed, confused, and in search of balance...
you're right, you are entertaining:
"Beyond this website, I believe that the discussion of the N word, is a proxy for a real engagement with the state of race and racism in this country."
That's what we've all been discussing... again, you propose very surface, redundant, irrelevant notions... why do you make us scroll through your mind-fucks to get to the meat of our discussion? |
Yukio
Veteran Poster
Username: Yukio
Post Number: 1451
Registered: 01-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, November 22, 2006 - 02:11 pm: |
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actually, toubobie: i didn't call u out, chrishayden did. LOL! I just used your comments to talk about something more interesting...
No, toubobie, this particular thread is about the word, the proxy,...which is actually superficial [read ABM's lean comments on the problematics of giving power to the word].
Finally, i'll not submit to questions of the best rhetorical strategies and name calling: it has never been my MO.
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Zuriburi
Regular Poster
Username: Zuriburi
Post Number: 156
Registered: 11-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, November 22, 2006 - 02:16 pm: |
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Yokio said: zuriburi: the use of the n word connotes only what the person who used it and what the listeners who interpret the word to mean.
I think that you are in denial about the levels of self contempt that permiates the black community. Neither at the individual or macroscopic level do we have the power to redefine the word nigga/nigger.
Yokio Said: But no disrespect, but these issues are really ancillary to my point!
Yokio it is my opinion that only way that the lot of black people is going to change and result in any kind of longterm and wide reaching improvement (ie...creating and maintaining self sustaining communities) within the community is if there is a significant psycological shift in the way that we view ourselves and eachother. The use of the N word is but one symptom of our own self contempt, it must be critiqued if only to bring to our collective immediate attention our current condition.
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Yukio
Veteran Poster
Username: Yukio
Post Number: 1452
Registered: 01-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, November 22, 2006 - 02:18 pm: |
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brilliant, read cynique's elegant comments on the power of the word. This is my point, what Cynique limns is part of that process that leads to a discussion of the N word becoming a proxy for real discussion. |
Yukio
Veteran Poster
Username: Yukio
Post Number: 1453
Registered: 01-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, November 22, 2006 - 02:32 pm: |
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zoribori:
The word, in fact, must be critiqued. And, though i doubt that the word has the psychological power on black that you have endowed it, black folk do need to be miseducated, as brother C.G. Woodson would say.
You are talking about the word as a symptom, and I think for some people it is. but, i am more along the lines of what Chris Hayden and ABM have said. That is, that folk give it too much power.
I dont buy that usage of the word connotes self-hatred. I'm not sure what you mean by self-contempt, but if you are talking about black on black crime and black male, and female for that matter, misogyny, then I would agree with that to some degree, but I would put the onus on economic matters and the racism that contribute to poverty that accounts for intragroup dynamics. Furthermore, I would say that much of what goes on among us, goes on among people, so that this is less a black person problem but an existential problem at the group level...
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Toubobie
Newbie Poster
Username: Toubobie
Post Number: 19
Registered: 08-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, November 22, 2006 - 03:16 pm: |
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yukie,
yeah, ya did call me out. but you know that already (wink). just be more careful next time around... you'll be 'aight, yo...
any discussion about the N word amongst African Americans about its 'power' or lack thereof is the real deal yukems, never proxy (perhaps in your own intellectual maze of a mind, it may be..)
Dare I suggest that you'd stoop to the level of engaging in discussions of proxy? and, yet, you continue to do so...
yuks', please, ennoble this discussion thread with yet another pointless summation of the obvious. *yawn* |
Zuriburi
Regular Poster
Username: Zuriburi
Post Number: 157
Registered: 11-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, November 22, 2006 - 04:40 pm: |
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Sorry for mispelling your name Yukio. But I see that you, in turn, mispelled mine. It's zUribUri.
I almost missed that. |
Yukio
Veteran Poster
Username: Yukio
Post Number: 1454
Registered: 01-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, November 22, 2006 - 05:05 pm: |
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hahaha....zuriburi. respect! |
Nels
Veteran Poster
Username: Nels
Post Number: 575
Registered: 07-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, November 22, 2006 - 09:22 pm: |
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In actuality, "nigger" is a state of mind, a type of behavior, a perception. Call a white person a nigger (with intent) and they will go ballistic. |
Robynmarie
Regular Poster
Username: Robynmarie
Post Number: 187
Registered: 04-2006
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, November 22, 2006 - 10:54 pm: |
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I agree with Yukio. The n-word is a proxy for the more important discussion of race and human bias.
We don't have the language to honestly discuss race in this country. What often happens is Black people get mad and white people get defensive and the communication breaks down.
So we all focus on a word most people will agree is objectionable. Though, I am sure there are lot of folks giving Kramer mental high fives.
BTW, KRamer or whatever his name is called Al Sharpton to "ask for forgiveness." What a croc of sh__.
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Mzuri
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Mzuri
Post Number: 2180
Registered: 01-2006
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, November 22, 2006 - 11:24 pm: |
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I think we've lost focus on the real issue. You could call me a nigger all day long - that doesn't bother me. White ppl have always referred to us that way and nothing's going to change. But when you bring up the subject of LYNCHING, and you either threaten me with it or make light of all our people who have been tortured in the past, then you've crossed the line and that's what I have a problem with. That's what was offensive about the man's comments and unfortunately, all the rants about the use of the "N" word will soon be forgotten (as soon as the next scandal erupts) and so will this whole episode if someone doesn't start talking about what's really going on. |
Yukio
Veteran Poster
Username: Yukio
Post Number: 1456
Registered: 01-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, November 23, 2006 - 02:25 am: |
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aww shit now...i see that tide is changing...!
Thats right, Mzuri! As our fallin brotha, MG, asked, "what's going on?"
In fact, as you listen to Richards, the audience doesn’t seem bothered when he says:
:http://us.video.aol.com/video.index.adp?mode=1&pmmsid=1772645
"50 yrs ago we'd have you upside down with a fucking fork up your ass!
But once he said nigga a few times folk got irate and some walked out. |
Satina
Newbie Poster
Username: Satina
Post Number: 32
Registered: 05-2006
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, November 24, 2006 - 01:54 pm: |
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Here's a clip of an actor who was offered a part on Seinfield a while back.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d8HfgFJnSCM&eurl
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Ntfs_encryption
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Ntfs_encryption
Post Number: 1156
Registered: 10-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, November 24, 2006 - 02:59 pm: |
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I saw the tape of Richards diatribe and it was disgusting. The guy really lost it. His apologies mean nothing after such an inexcusable racist rant in frustration and anger. I can understand his aggravation with the hecklers but there was no need to go to the race card since race was irrelevant to the conflict. But he did. Which reveals some deep rooted subconscious issues or mindset that he had already had. Needless to say, a lot of people were shocked, upset and angry. Black folks were at the top of the list of the incensed –no surprise there. But what I don’t understand, if blacks are so indignant and outraged over the use of the “n” word, why as a group, are they not outraged over the mindless relentless streaming of the “n” word from the show Def Jam Comedy with host Mike Epps (who is one of the worst offenders -it’s so bad that I often cannot watch him) or the comedians who are on the program? The profanity and “n” word are used to the level of total absurdity. I have yet to see a word from anyone contesting this. Why?
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Mzuri
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Mzuri
Post Number: 2183
Registered: 01-2006
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, November 24, 2006 - 04:03 pm: |
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NTFS - The word "nigger" is not going to be out of use anytime soon. As you probably know we now have wiggers (white niggers), chiggers (chinese niggers), jiggers (jewish niggers), miggers (blacks who have converted to Islam) and on and on - so the word is firmly entrenched and has spawned variations. We need to focus on why white people feel that they can blatantly and overtly insult us as a group and how they can make fun of something so vicious, vile and inhumane as lynching. And people just sit around as if it's nothing.  |
Ntfs_encryption
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Ntfs_encryption
Post Number: 1161
Registered: 10-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, November 24, 2006 - 05:25 pm: |
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”NTFS - The word "nigger" is not going to be out of use anytime soon. As you probably know we now have wiggers (white niggers), chiggers (chinese niggers), jiggers (jewish niggers), miggers (blacks who have converted to Islam) and on and on - so the word is firmly entrenched and has spawned variations.”
Unfortunately, you are 100% correct. No argument here. But my addendum to this is simply I find it equally contemptuous and repulsive for black people to use the word also. I make no distinctions. In fact, I find it to be even more disgusting. I never use the word nor do I tolerate it. NO ONE SHOULD USE IT -PERIOD! No exceptions and no excuses. I won’t condemn Richards for his racist diatribe and give those ignorant confused Negroes on Def Jam Comedy a free pass. Not gonna happen. AGAIN –I MAKE NO DISTINCTIONS NOR ARE THERE ANY EXCEPTIONS TO THE USE OF THE WORD. It’s a vile, racist and historically disturbing word that should never be used, especially by black people since they are the specific reason and the orignal target of the word whites created –to degrade and reduce them to a sub-human level.
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Abm
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Abm
Post Number: 6819
Registered: 04-2004
Rating: 
Votes: 3 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, November 25, 2006 - 11:05 am: |
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I reserve the right and privilege to say NIGGER when and how I dayamwell please. |
Yukio
Veteran Poster
Username: Yukio
Post Number: 1459
Registered: 01-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, November 25, 2006 - 11:18 am: |
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Thats My NIGGA! |
Abm
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Abm
Post Number: 6822
Registered: 04-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, November 25, 2006 - 11:21 am: |
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Yukio,
Some niggas must be crazy thinking they can tell other niggas what they can and can't say.
HAHAHAHAHA!!! |
Yukio
Veteran Poster
Username: Yukio
Post Number: 1460
Registered: 01-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, November 25, 2006 - 04:32 pm: |
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nigga, you aint neva lie! |
Mzuri
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Mzuri
Post Number: 2195
Registered: 01-2006
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, November 25, 2006 - 04:41 pm: |
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It doesn't bother us when we call each other a nigger, but do we want ppl to call our children that? Or our grandchildren? Probably not. |
Yukio
Veteran Poster
Username: Yukio
Post Number: 1461
Registered: 01-2004
Rating:
Votes: 1 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, November 25, 2006 - 05:08 pm: |
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I do not have children, so I am at a loss, here. I have not had to consider that issue, and when I have, I am often unflinchingly radical [maybe not].
That is, I often prefer folk to be honest of their doubt of my humanity, than fool me to think that they see me and respect me as a human being.
But this is, an indeed, frightening position, on my part. For if a white person calls one of us, especially a 'chile,'a niggah, it is meant to hurt...and no one would prefer that their child endure, that kind of, or any kind for that manner, vituperation. |
Mzuri
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Mzuri
Post Number: 2196
Registered: 01-2006
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, November 25, 2006 - 05:18 pm: |
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If your hypothetical child comes crying to you that someone called them a nigger - I promise you it will break your heart.  |
Yukio
Veteran Poster
Username: Yukio
Post Number: 1462
Registered: 01-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, November 25, 2006 - 06:26 pm: |
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thus, the question becomes, how do we teach our children about their history and their present without damping their love in the human spirit?
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Cynique
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Cynique
Post Number: 5842
Registered: 01-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, November 25, 2006 - 06:44 pm: |
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Sure, we can fondly address each other as "nigga" but in, truth, "nigga" and "nigger" are not the same word. They have a different definitions, and in the case of the word "nigger", it's better to give than to receive. |
Ntfs_encryption
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Ntfs_encryption
Post Number: 1168
Registered: 10-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, November 26, 2006 - 12:30 am: |
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"I reserve the right and privilege to say NIGGER when and how I dayamwell please."
Too bad. Better you than me. I personally have no desire nor need to continue to provide a life line or free pass to a word that was created to categorically degrade and dehumanize me, my parents, my friends, every black person on this planet and the very existence of black people since our initial contact with whites. Unfortunately, for you and other blacks, calling other blacks the "n" word is of no consequence nor importance, regardless of who is in earshot. There is nothing wrong with doing so. In fact, according to the logic of many blacks, it's a good thing to refer to other blacks as "niggers", "nigga's", etc.... Why not? Every other race and ethnic group refers to blacks as "niggers". So it must be the right thing to do. Right..?
"Sure, we can fondly address each other as "nigga" but in, truth, "nigga" and "nigger" are not the same word. They have a different definitions, and in the case of the word "nigger", it's better to give than to receive."
Too bad again. I make no distinction. The word has no place in the mind or mouth of any black person, for any reason, under no circumstances and no exceptions, under any conditions -period! Yes, know I'm the only person on this board who refuses to lend credibility and special circumstances to the use of this disgusting and vile racist word. I completely reject the disingenuous relativism excuse for the use of the "n" word. So all the readers of this board will have to excuse my strident and steadfast defiance and belligerence to the use of this grievous racist epitaph. But I make nor will I give any apologies for refusing to call or accept a black person, referring to other blacks, as a nigger's, nigga's, niggaz's, niggoo's, igga's, niggett's, niggrett's or any other variation of this historically despicable nauseating word. E’nuff said….
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Yukio
Veteran Poster
Username: Yukio
Post Number: 1463
Registered: 01-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, November 26, 2006 - 03:17 pm: |
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ntfs_encryption:
as vile as the word is, you have used it more so than any of its so-called defenders. furthermore, the position that you hold has been promulgated, already. so apparently, you are not the "only person on this board who refuses to lend credibility" to nigga/er.
elder cynique, i doubt if a cracka as cracka was calling a black person the N word that it would be pronounced in standard english...LOL! |
Yvettep
Veteran Poster
Username: Yvettep
Post Number: 1433
Registered: 01-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, November 27, 2006 - 09:43 am: |
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I'm the only person on this board who refuses to lend credibility and special circumstances to the use of this disgusting and vile racist word
No, you are not. I am one of those who believe Black folks ought not be saying it either. I have heard all the arguments, and I simply do not buy them. I have learned that it is a losing battle to try to convince folks who believe otherwise, however, so I just usually stay out of these conversations.
One thing I will say: It takes zero creativity to use that word, as a Black person, in a subversive/ironic/"loving"/etc way. If folks can think of no other way to express these sentiments than falling back on a word that others designed to help oppress us, then that's just lazy.
If folks won't give it up because they do not think it is wrong for Blacks to say it, I wish they'd at least consider giving it up because it's just played out.
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Abm
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Abm
Post Number: 6829
Registered: 04-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, November 27, 2006 - 10:41 am: |
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NTFS,
I've been called OTHER things that can be deemed dehumanizing. And some of them have NOTHING to do with my race.
I'll bet you have too.
Have you attempted to abolish any of them?
Yvettep,
You could say the SAME about myriad OTHER words that have endured years and generations. |
Yukio
Veteran Poster
Username: Yukio
Post Number: 1465
Registered: 01-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, November 27, 2006 - 12:27 pm: |
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nigga please! |
Cynique
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Cynique
Post Number: 5844
Registered: 01-2004
Rating:
Votes: 1 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, November 27, 2006 - 01:44 pm: |
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Well, the debate over the word "nigger" and its variations is ongoing and the one thing that can't be disputed is that it is a very subjective word. Certain other words in the black-white paradigm are also guaranteed to provoke. Let a white person refer to a group of black folks as "you people," or let a white man address a black man as "boy" and the resentment will be instant. Words are weapons and the reaction they command is what empowers the person who uses them. |
Abm
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Abm
Post Number: 6832
Registered: 04-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, November 27, 2006 - 02:25 pm: |
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Dayam, Yukio. I thought you and me was niggas. |
Yukio
Veteran Poster
Username: Yukio
Post Number: 1467
Registered: 01-2004
Rating:
Votes: 1 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, November 28, 2006 - 01:26 am: |
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we are niggas...nigga, why u tripin? |
Abm
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Abm
Post Number: 6835
Registered: 04-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, November 28, 2006 - 07:55 am: |
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Yukio,
My bad. We straight, bruh.
'Cause you know us niggas gottah stick together. |
Cynique
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Cynique
Post Number: 5848
Registered: 01-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, November 28, 2006 - 11:37 am: |
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Who said y'all aren't niggas?????? |
Yukio
Veteran Poster
Username: Yukio
Post Number: 1468
Registered: 01-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, November 28, 2006 - 08:26 pm: |
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ight, abm. niggas gonna work it out! |
Misty
Regular Poster
Username: Misty
Post Number: 368
Registered: 02-2006
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, November 28, 2006 - 10:40 pm: |
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true, kramers tirade is no different from what black standup comics get up there and say about other blackp people...BUT it doesnt mean it should be excused or tolerated just because black people get up there and spread hatred about other black people. |
Troy
Regular Poster
Username: Troy
Post Number: 466
Registered: 01-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, November 29, 2006 - 07:55 pm: |
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Check out an article on the subject by Marvin X: http://authors.aalbc.com/nigguh_please.htm
Yukio, regarding your response to Ntfs_encryption: I thought NTFS was joking. He used the N-words more times than MF! Then I read the earilier posts and figured he was indeed not joking.
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Yukio
Veteran Poster
Username: Yukio
Post Number: 1471
Registered: 01-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, November 29, 2006 - 08:31 pm: |
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troy: i agree with Marvin X, for the most part. he seems to equate the usage between blacks and whites as the same. but that is an error. |
Ntfs_encryption
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Ntfs_encryption
Post Number: 1175
Registered: 10-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, November 29, 2006 - 09:16 pm: |
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"One thing I will say: It takes zero creativity to use that word, as a Black person, in a subversive/ironic/"loving"/etc way. If folks can think of no other way to express these sentiments than falling back on a word that others designed to help oppress us, then that's just lazy."
Thank you Ms.Yvettep. It simply amazes me how any black person would even attmept to justify the use of this word under any circumstances and for any reason. There are none!
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Ntfs_encryption
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Ntfs_encryption
Post Number: 1176
Registered: 10-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, November 29, 2006 - 09:18 pm: |
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"as vile as the word is, you have used it more so than any of its so-called defenders."
Excuse me???? I don't think so! You have confused me with someone else. Think not? PLEASE PRODUCE JUST ONE POST WHERE I CALLED ANYONE -ON THIS BOARD OR OTHERWISE, THE "N" WORD!! Again, please produce the evidence and prove your case. I will wait for your response.
I don't ever recall having an out of body experience where I wrote something and called someone a term as disgusting as the "N" word and did not recall doing so. Refresh my memory.
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Abm
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Abm
Post Number: 6839
Registered: 04-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, November 29, 2006 - 09:29 pm: |
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Ntfs,
You really outtah idle down the righteous indignation bit some. |
Ntfs_encryption
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Ntfs_encryption
Post Number: 1177
Registered: 10-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, November 29, 2006 - 09:37 pm: |
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"You really outtah idle down the righteous indignation bit some."
No self righteous indignation here ABM. Sorry. When someone accuses me of something I know to be false, well….. I have to call them out so they can prove their accusations. I'm sure you would do the same if someone made a false accusation concerning something you did not do. Makes sense..???
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Cynique
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Cynique
Post Number: 5863
Registered: 01-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, November 29, 2006 - 09:58 pm: |
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I hear ya, NTFS. Since when has it been an infringment to strongly defend yourself against lies??? |
Troy
Regular Poster
Username: Troy
Post Number: 468
Registered: 01-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, November 29, 2006 - 11:35 pm: |
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Hi NTFS,
Just in case you were refering to me as accusing you of using the n-word. I was refering to your use in this post http://www.thumperscorner.com/cgi/discus/show.cgi?tpc=179&post=74438#POST74438
I just found it amusing in your righteous indignation stressing your desire not to use the word that you actually you used it, or variation of it about 20 times.
Usually people write something like "N-word".
Yukio, I agree with Marvin as well. Personally, I just do not use the word like he does.
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Cynique
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Cynique
Post Number: 5867
Registered: 01-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, November 29, 2006 - 11:50 pm: |
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So maybe the only way to settle this volatile issue is to make nigger an equal opportunity word. Everybody should just use it whenever they please. Say it till their heart's content! Who cares? Once it is no longer taboo, maybe it will lose its power - niggerniggerniggerniggerniggerniggerniuggernigger, it's just a garbled sound. OK??? |
Yukio
Veteran Poster
Username: Yukio
Post Number: 1475
Registered: 01-2004
Rating:
Votes: 1 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, November 30, 2006 - 12:32 am: |
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Damn yaw niggahs r' crazy! Not you, of course, NTFS.
By the way, I am the culprit. I , not Troy, said that you used the n-word. But you too are guilty of abusing the word...LOL! In your "righteous indignation," as Troy has already indicated, you used it gazillion times! You have been outted and aint nothing you can say! It doesn't matter your intentions...LOL! YOu said:
The word has no place in the mind or mouth of any black person, for any reason, under no circumstances and no exceptions, under any conditions -period!
And then you the n-word and various derivations of it more than ten times.
Troy, exactly! I dont use the word like that either! |
Ntfs_encryption
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Ntfs_encryption
Post Number: 1180
Registered: 10-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, November 30, 2006 - 11:38 am: |
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”I just found it amusing in your righteous indignation stressing your desire not to use the word that you actually you used it, or variation of it about 20 times.”
There seems to be some confusion here, so let me clarify. When you saw the word “nigger” written in my posts (which often may be substituted with “N” word), it is usually in quotes, which signifies I’m using it in a particular context. The context is related to my alleged “righteous indignation” to the inexcusable usage of the word (and all its silly variations) by blacks and all the mindless justifications and excuses for doing so. I never said I never wrote the word –I SAID I NEVER CALLED ANYONE (NOR USED IT IN A GLIB MANNER) THIS DIGUSTING RACIST WORD. The only time you have seen the word in my posts was when I was condemning its usage –not calling someone or referring to other blacks as such.
”In your "righteous indignation," as Troy has already indicated, you used it gazillion times! You have been outted and aint nothing you can say! It doesn't matter your intentions...LOL! YOu said: The word has no place in……………
And then you the n-word and various derivations of it more than ten times.”
Are you smoking crack when you write? What do you not understand?? EVERY SINGLE TIME WHERE I WROTE THE WORD “NIGGER” OR THE “N” WORD, I WAS CONDEMING THE USE OF THE WORD BY BLACK PEOPLE (OR ANYONE ELSE WHO IS NOT BLACK) WHEN ADDRESSING OTHER BLACK PEOPLE! ONCE AGAIN, IF YOU HAVE FAILED TO NOTICE (WHICH IS OBVIOUSLY THE CASE), I HAVE NEVER CALLED ANYONE ON THIS BOARD NOR USED THE WORD, “NIGGER”, “NIGGA”, “NIKKA”, “NIGGAZ”, ETC, IN A CAVALIER CONTEXT. I have no idea how you confused me writing the word with quotes (most of the time) when condemning its usage and using it as an unfortunate number of blacks do on a daily basis -in private and in public. There is a difference. Sorry bro, but I have no idea how you twisted that one around. E'nuff said....
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Abm
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Abm
Post Number: 6841
Registered: 04-2004
Rating:
Votes: 1 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, November 30, 2006 - 12:10 pm: |
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Ntfs,
I think it's pretty clear to those who've read your posts on this subject that you loathe the use of the word nigger. No person who reads at above the 4th grade reading level would miss that.
And that's cool. It's your American right and privilege to think and feel about nigger as you choose to.
Just as it's my (and my nikka Yukio's) American right and privilege to say nigger when and how I dayamwell please.
And because there is no anti-nigger recitation clause or amendment in the U.S. Constitution, you should smartly (as Yvettep appears to have done) reserve your "righteous indignation" about nigger for something that's WORTH being righteously indignant about.
But, again, you are free to do otherwise. |
Yvettep
Veteran Poster
Username: Yvettep
Post Number: 1435
Registered: 01-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, November 30, 2006 - 01:52 pm: |
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I think righteous indignation of intra-race use of the n-word is worth it. I just do not see much change in attitudes in my decades of conversation. Thus you get folks waxing fondly of their mother calling them n***** (Would they do the same for mothers calling their little girls "b****" I wonder?), calling their friends n***** (As if being another n******'s n***** makes everything cool), and saying Whites should be able to say it these days (Though I do not hear for a similar call for all of us to start calling any other group any other slur).
Whatever. Dismay, I think, is warranted. The ability to change the minds of those who embrace the term, I think, is largely an uphill battle. |
Cynique
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Cynique
Post Number: 5873
Registered: 01-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, November 30, 2006 - 02:04 pm: |
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You are rignt, Yvette, especially since usage of the word nigger/nigga in the black community is starting to acquire a mystique of defiance and there ain't nothin a nigga likes better to do, than to defy. |
Mzuri
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Mzuri
Post Number: 2216
Registered: 01-2006
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, November 30, 2006 - 02:46 pm: |
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I haven't kept up with this thread but I wonder if the ppl who feel it's okay to call each other niggas think it's alright to use this word in the workplace? Would you say it to your boss? And if you're the HNIC, could your employees/insubordinates say it to you? If not, why not??? |
Abm
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Abm
Post Number: 6845
Registered: 04-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, November 30, 2006 - 03:42 pm: |
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Yvettep,
I concur with your last sentence. Really...is this battle that's worth Black foks fighting over?
I don't think so. |
Yukio
Veteran Poster
Username: Yukio
Post Number: 1481
Registered: 01-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, December 01, 2006 - 04:20 pm: |
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Ntfs_encryption:
it seems that you dont understand. we have been taking you at your WORD. As my nicca, ABM, has limned, we know your intensions. BUT, according to YOU, the word should not be used...LOL! NOT even in condemning it...LOL!
take note of Yvettep's shared contempt, but of more import the ABSENCE of the word in her comments...see the difference?
Anyways, we got ya point...long, long ago.
thanx! |
Abm
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Abm
Post Number: 6852
Registered: 04-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, December 01, 2006 - 04:27 pm: |
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Yukio,
You think if I called Yvettep My Niggress, she'd take offense?
I mean it in the best possible context. |
Yukio
Veteran Poster
Username: Yukio
Post Number: 1482
Registered: 01-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, December 01, 2006 - 04:34 pm: |
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mzuri:
there are always qualifications. but to ans. your questions:
1. no to the workplace
2. no to the boss
3. no if I was the HNIC [this is implicitly answered by question 2]
4.No because work is work and play is play! the n-word, sexy, my dog, etc...are generally not part of any workplace, unless you are a hip hop producer in the studio.
On the usage of the word: ABM and I, for example, use it as AALBC colleagues[for more than three years I think], and fundamentally because we share a similar idiomatic, perhap socio-economic, and intellectual culture embedded in life experiences, street culture, african american working class culture and black music culture, and finally our wide readings. Our usage, Mzuri, is quite different from dem cats in the streets....we are, as this thread shows, fully conversant in this debate, we know what we are doing and what it means when we say what we say, and we are intelligent enough, at the end of the day, to be selective and purposeful when we use the word....NIGGA!
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Yukio
Veteran Poster
Username: Yukio
Post Number: 1483
Registered: 01-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, December 01, 2006 - 04:35 pm: |
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abm:
i'm leavin that alone...LOL! |
Mzuri
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Mzuri
Post Number: 2225
Registered: 01-2006
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, December 01, 2006 - 05:26 pm: |
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Well, this is what I think about it - if you feel that it's okay to use the word, then you should be able to use it freely anyplace and anytime including in the workplace. Freedom of speech is in full effect, right? What consequence would anyone suffer from calling someone a nigger or a nigga in the workplace??? It's just a word, right? So you should be able to tell your boy "Hey nigga, what about those copies I asked you for?" Makes sense to me. |
Abm
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Abm
Post Number: 6853
Registered: 04-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, December 01, 2006 - 05:33 pm: |
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Yukio,
Chickenshyt nukka!! |
Abm
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Abm
Post Number: 6854
Registered: 04-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, December 01, 2006 - 05:38 pm: |
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Yukio,
There are all KINDS of shyt I'd say to, around and about FRIENDS/COMPANIONS of mine I wouldn't be caught dead saying to mofo's I hardly know, trust or care about; be they White, Black or Purple.
'Cause, dayam. If I can't kick it real wit my nikkas, who the hell else can a nikka kick it real WIT? |
Cynique
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Cynique
Post Number: 5892
Registered: 01-2004
Rating:
Votes: 11 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, December 01, 2006 - 06:20 pm: |
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That's a good point, Mzuri! Why be selective in using a word that's so endearing, so cogent, so macho! If it's good enough to use among friends, it's good enough for the workplace or church or school, unless of course it's usuage requires a secrecy that has to be kept under wraps, lest others find it offensive. Using the n-word and all of its variations is anybody's free choice. Trying to justify its use is an exercise in obfuscation. |
Mzuri
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Mzuri
Post Number: 2227
Registered: 01-2006
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, December 01, 2006 - 07:44 pm: |
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Obviously some niggas are just confused. They know it's wrong but will defend to the death that it's aight to use it with the homies - because they're cool like that. But they can't say it around boss-man, po-po-man, whitey-man, their momma, their wife, their children, the preacher, etc. because deep down inside they know it's wrong. Yup, that's some obfuscatory shit alright. Just like some niggas. LOLOL! |
Yukio
Veteran Poster
Username: Yukio
Post Number: 1486
Registered: 01-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, December 01, 2006 - 09:23 pm: |
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abm: nicca, you know I got cha back...but I aint tryin get on that sistas bad side.
thats right...whether folk wanna realize shit or not, all folk have their own intragroup, intrapersonal cohort behavior that often transcends race, class, ethnicity, etc...some niccas, I jus dont fuk wit...and it ain b/c their white either...
Cynique: shut yo mouth...you know you dont believe that...LOL!
Mzuri: i dont buy that logic...that is assuming all is equal and it aint! it is not a question of right and wrong, it is a question of perception, acknowledgement of power relations, and basic respect and comfortability with your self. It is, in a basic way, like everything else, how do i live, love, and get what I want w/o sacrificing completely my own notion of integrity.
u call it free speech, and I can call it a hate crime...all of these laws, policies, etc...are tools that dont necessarily adhere to some logic. Consequently, if we had to go to court, who know who would win. |
Mzuri
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Mzuri
Post Number: 2230
Registered: 01-2006
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, December 01, 2006 - 10:09 pm: |
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Y - You are free to speak however you choose. Obviously I was trying to make a point. And I know you don't know me but let me just briefly say that I am retired federal govt civil service (Dept of Army 20+ years) and was a labor union official for a major part of that. Was the HNIC of a local that represented approx 3,000 bargaining unit employees for a couple of years, the second in charge for about three and held some other executive positions. I have represented federal employees in EEOC mediations, filed numerous ULP charges with the FLRA, dealt one-on-one with commanding officers and upper level management who were my counterparts. Assisted in showing some worthless employees out the door and saved some good ones from getting fired. So I know all about what is and is not appropriate in the workplace. For the most part, I speak the same regardless of who's listening because I don't really give a damn. About nobody. |
Yukio
Veteran Poster
Username: Yukio
Post Number: 1488
Registered: 01-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, December 02, 2006 - 04:44 am: |
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Mzuri: I got you point. It is a legitimate one, but one that I dont believe in...i don't believe in equality; i believe that is a goal for which we strive...and that striving is an uphill battle, that is both individual and collective...and I'm doing both at the time....I have chosen to give a damn; i chosen to represent what I believe in... |
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